The best Christian Bible Criticism & Interpretation books: Reddit reviews

From 3.5 billion Reddit comments

Except that’s not what happens. They eat of the fruit of knowledge which is what kicks them out. It’s an allegory for adulthood/leaving behind innocence, knowing the difference between right/ wrong and being self aware enough to feel shame (hence covering the body.) The creation story is an explanation why humanity isn’t childlike, and living in paradise. A lot of modern translations have tamed down the sexual language in scripture but there is a shit ton of sex, and sex play going on in the Bible. The Book of Genesis by Robert Crumb is a silly read but good at shocking people into realize how much sex goes on in the Bible.

Neither. The Hebrew word for "day" there definitely means 24-hour time period, but that doesn't mean the universe was made in 6 literal days.

Genesis 1 is complex and beautiful, but ancient Near-Eastern people don't think like modern Western people, and ancient Near-Eastern people wrote Genesis 1. It's way too much to explain here. Read The Lost World of Genesis One, by John Walton.

> For a good counter argument, read https://www.amazon.com/Evidence-That-Demands-Verdict-Life-Changing/dp/1401676707 > > EDIT. I'm not surprised you are all downvoting me, and now I've got an "lol" mocking. > > At any rate, I have a large collection of theological book, written by scholars, doctors, and even half-crazy people. > > If you do not read the other side, you do not understand where they are coming from. > > Futher, studying theology is like studying a language, doubles twice as well if you can speak both.... > > Those are not all my theology books, my books aren't really that organized by topic. > > EDIT AGAIN: One final thought -- I had a middle school English teacher tell me a couple things that really resounded with me. One of which was that everyone should have a library. Most people in the modern world that do this keep them digitally, which is awesome. I grew up in the age where that didn't exist. We had books. I have lots of books. Many of them are books that are totally against what I think/believe/accept/like. I read them anyways, because I'd rather not be ignorant debating for or against something I feel strongly about. > > And again, if you'd like to be stimulated by a thoughtful counter argument, grab the book I mentioned and read it; there is a reason it has sold millions of copies, you can probably find it at an estate sale for a quarter, and its not because early indoctrination, it's because thought process takes more than a reddit post or a snide personality.

Good god the "I KNOW WHAT IM TALKING ABOUT, SEE, I POSTED PICTURES OF BOOOKS" argument.

Oh and you are an idiot to boot... just saying

I want truth. That's my quest.

And if you are on a truth quest, I would encourage you to check out is God a moral monster by Paul Copan.

Down a bit I made some comments about God being the only one who can define morality.

https://www.amazon.com/God-Moral-Monster-Making-Testament/dp/0801072751

An accessible work written about this subject is Did Jesus Exist?: The Historical Argument for Jesus of Nazareth.

More about this subject can be found at the wiki/FAQ pages here: https://www.reddit.com/r/AskBibleScholars/wiki/faq

Specifically, numbers 12, 32, and 34.

Along with everything listed here, your friends may be inclined to listen to Bart Ehrman. He's an atheist New Testament scholar who has written and spoken quite a bit against Jesus mythicism. Be aware that as an atheist he has many claims about both the historicity of certain parts of the bible and the figure of Christ himself that I find problematic, but he does a good job refuting the idea that Jesus never existed period. If you or your friends enjoy reading, his book Did Jesus Exist? is a good presentation a secular case for the historical figure of Jesus. He has also been on the radio show/podcast Unbelievable?
If you like podcasts, then Unbelievable? has a ton of great episodes debating this issue if you search through the archives. (And, might I add, if you're doing any kind of apologetics it's a great resource to listen to Christians having fantastic apologetics discourse with people from all kinds of belief systems.)

I second this. I got R. Crumb's Illustrated Book of Genesis to read with my daughter. (Highly recommend! The illustrations are perfect, and he actually chose a decent translation. Given his history, I expected something entirely different.)

Such silly stories. Such interesting discussions. We got about 2/3 of the way through Genesis before we gave up. Her comment was, "They call it the good book, but it's not a very good book."

To start this off I’m not religious at, but all faith is definitely compatible with science. Anyone who says otherwise is plain wrong.

The creation story in Genesis is not meant to be read literally. Even some of the Fathers of the Church, like Saint Augustine, didn’t take Genesis literally. Instead, he thought everything was created in an instant. Of course this position isn’t really taken seriously anymore, but it goes to show that young-earth creationism is not and has never been the traditional position of Christians. Augustine said that if one’s interpretation of the Bible conflicted with well-established scientific findings, that interpretation must be revised.

Likewise, anyone who says that Christians cannot be successful scientists is also wrong. Nicolas Steno, the founder of stratigraphy, was a devout Catholic. Georges Lemaître, who devised the Big Bang Theory which is the foundation of modern astronomy, was a priest. Einstein was a pantheist. And to top it off the man who led the Human Genome Project, Francis Collins, is a Christian. Many faithful scientists believe that science can enhance, not deteriorate, faith.

The philosopher Thomas Aquinas believed that faith and reason could never conflict, since the same God created them. If God exists, he would likely create a world that people could study and interpret.

I’m completely unafraid of hell because it’s an incoherent idea (I think the same about “god” btw). I can’t be afraid of a married bachelor or a round square because I am unable to even imagine a logically coherent representation of those things since they are self-contradictory.

We’ve all been taught to be afraid of hell since early childhood, but just like we’re told not to look directly at the sun, we weren’t encouraged to think clearly about the details of hell, were we? That’s because there aren’t any, and attempts to form a coherent description of hell that is consonant with “god’s” supposed nature, scripture, and logic always fail.

David Bentley Hart, possibly the most prominent English-speaking theologian working today, wrote an entire book about how he thinks the eternal conscious torment version of hell not only doesn’t exist but can’t exist. Further, he argues that if any form of Christianity truly teaches this, it’s a sign that form of Christianity is false.

I’m personally biased to think that all forms of Christianity, indeed all human religions are false in the sense that none of them fully and accurately describe reality…but anyway maybe this theologian is right? If he is right, then you have nothing to fear. Be a good person, do your best, the “god” this guy believes in is not a sadistic, evil maniac like the Catholic “god.”

If people are interested in how severe a lot of these laws are, The Year Of Living Biblically by AJ Jacobs is really interesting, very approachable, and fairly humorous.

This may not be a direct response to your question, but hopefully it will be helpful. I read this book several (like 8-10) years ago and found it helpful and accessible to a lay audience:

"Is God a Moral Monster"? by Paul Copan

I can't say for sure that it's as good as I thought it was back then, but maybe someone in here has a more recent recollection of it or a similar work.

If I remember correctly, he addresses the issue from several perspectives, such as the genre of the text being more hyperbolic than literal, the notice given to the Caananites to evacuate prior to individual conquests, and yes, I believe he addresses the issue of God's will in multiple senses (which seems to be the core of your question).

The overwhelming academic consensus is that there was a historical Jesus, the mythicist hypothesis (which is the main competitor) is really fringe (not that there aren't biblical scholars and peer-reviewed papers that support it, but they're treated kind of like climatologists who deny anthropogenic global warming).

Bart Ehrman (an extremely respected NT scholar who generally identifies as an agnostic) wrote a book for non-scholars on the topic, Did Jesus Exist?, but while I recommend Ehrman's work generally, I haven't read that particular book.

https://www.amazon.com/God-Moral-Monster-Making-Testament/dp/0801072751

This is a complex question, please have a look at this book which tackles this topic in depth.

https://youtu.be/NW2dgvRi8lA

Also a video directly addressing the topic.

1) the historical consensus is that Jesus did, in fact, exist. Bart Ehrman, the world's leading atheistic Bible scholar, even wrote a book dedicated to explaining to other atheists that Jesus did in fact exist: https://www.amazon.com/Did-Jesus-Exist-Historical-Argument/dp/0062206443

2) So what if every religion thinks they're right and the others are wrong. the same is true of political ideologies. That's just how a debate works.

Hey buddy. Here’s a book about universal salvation that is sure to relieve you of your worries:

https://www.amazon.com/That-All-Shall-Saved-Universal/dp/0300246226

I suffer from OCD also. If you want to talk about it, message me. I would love to talk about it and share my experiences with you. Trust me, I know OCD and the thoughts that it presents extremely well. I know you are in a dark place right now, but you will be okay. You are safe.

“Fear not” is in the Bible 365 times. God wants you to be free of anxiety, not full of dread and despair. You are not going to Hell, nor are your loved ones.

If you have not yet done so, check out David Bentley Hart's book That All Shall Be Saved. He is a reputable scholar, and in that book he provides not only an excellent argument in favor of universalism, but answers your specific question about αιον.

Below is just one paragraph from several pages dealing with the Greek words αιων and αιωνιος:

>No matter how we interpret the discrete terms, however, we must never forget that today the entire ensemble of references that we bring to these phrases is wholly detached from the religious world of Christ's time, and particularly from its eschatological expectations. It seems absolutely certain, for instance, that the words αιων and αιωνιος are frequently used in the New Testament as some kind of reference to the 'olam ha-ba, "the Age to come," which is to say the Age of God's Kingdom, or of that cosmic reality now hidden in God that will be made manifest at history's end. It seems fairly certain, at least, that in the New Testament, and especially in the teachings of Jesus, the adjective αιωνιος is the equivalent of something like the phrase le-olam; and yet it is no less certain that this usage cannot be neatly discriminated from the language of the 'olam ha-ba without losing something of the special significance it surely possessed in Christ's time. The issue then is not one of how long, but rather of when, or of what frame of reality -- what realm, that is, within or beyond history.

That last sentence answers your question most succinctly: the words αιων and αιωνιος refer more to a "when" and less to a "how long" time frame.

InspiringPhilosophy has many videos on Genesis which collate and summarize some relevant Biblical scholarship on this issue. Check them out!

We of course need to realize that Genesis is an ancient text, written by ancient prescientific people for prescientific people. If we think Genesis is teaching modern science, we are missing the point and missing what God is trying to show us through the text today. Biblical scholar John Walton's The Lost World of Genesis One should be required reading for Christians in my opinion and will also more than adequately answer your question.

Two books I would recommend on this topic: The Lost World of Genesis One and Genesis Unbound.

One author was a professor of Old Testament studies at Golden Gate Baptist Theological Seminary and was president of the Evangelical Theological Society. The other author is an Old Testament scholar and professor at Wheaton College/Moody Bible Institute. Serious, Jesus-loving Bible scholars, who are doing some really in-depth exegesis and work with the original language and cultural context and not some fringe YouTube wingnuts.

Genesis Unbound dives into the opening of Genesis 1 and explores why it might not be talking about the planet as it is modernly understood. The Lost World of Genesis One dives more into the cultural context of Genesis and how ancient audiences might have understood and comprehended it.

the historical and scholarly consensus is that Jesus did, in fact, exist.

Bart ehrman, the world's leading atheistic Bible scholar, wrote a book dedicated to explaining this to other atheists. https://www.amazon.com/Did-Jesus-Exist-Historical-Argument/dp/0062206443

Check out David Bentley Hart. He's an Eastern Orthodox theologian who defends universalism very well. His book that does so is That All Shall Be Saved.

Well the problem is that we really have to have annotations instead of commentary...

There are so many self-referential elements to the text that to not explain them is to do a disservice to the audience.

It's just that we're 200 years ahead of our time... If you get an annotated Bible now the annotations are all you know college level discussions of language and time and place and person and you get a massive amount of scholarship crammed in there.

we just don't have people who are willing to do that for Zen texts in the academic world... What we get is religious people trying to put their spin on what it means to practice mu.

That doesn't mean that the information isn't out there and that putting it in one place wouldn't be useful.

If you've never seen the Oxford... https://www.amazon.com/dp/0190276088/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_sAqaGbY9HG5WQ

The issue there is of course that this text is aggressively secular to the point of being almost insulting to lots of different religions.

Search David Bentley Hart into YouTube or podcast outlets for interviews surrounding his fantastic, sophisticated, formidable, and so far undefeated book That All Shall Be Saved

Yale University Press: https://yalebooks.yale.edu/book/9780300246223/all-shall-be-saved

Amazon: $23.40 USD That All Shall Be Saved: Heaven, Hell, and Universal Salvation https://www.amazon.com/dp/0300246226/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_O44.CbWM0VRCF

Will be released September 24, 2019

The same as Old Testament Scholar John Walton. He argues that Genesis 1 is actually about God assigning function to the cosmos in a 7 day period, and not about an actual material creation. By comparing the creation account in Genesis 1 with these other accounts, including those from Egypt, Babylon, and Mesopotamia, we can see some big similarities between Genesis 1 and the creation myths of Israel’s neighbors.

His main arguments are 1. Ancient Near Eastern creation accounts are typically concerned with function, rather than material origins. 2. The Hebrew term bāra͗ (“to create”) refers to the assignment of functions. 3. The beginning state of Gen 1:2 is one that lacks function, not materiality 4. The first three days establish the major life-sustaining functions of time, weather, and food. 5. In days four through six God assigns functions to plants and animals. 6. The refrain, “It was good,” is a comment on function. 7. God’s rest on the seventh day implies that he is taking up residence in his temple, since “everyone” in the ancient world knew that “deity rests in a temple, and only in a temple” (p. 72).

The Lost World of Genesis One

In addition to other comments, here you go:

https://www.amazon.com/Miracles-Credibility-New-Testament-Accounts/dp/0801039525

And you will note that anytime anyone brings up an example of a miracle, even if their doctor or nurse supported that interpretation, there's always an excuse about why it doesn't count. There's certainly observation bias on each side, but let's no one pretend the indefensible "science proves miracles wrong" group doesn't have it in spades.

>I'm gonna go ahead and guess you can't actually defend your assertion.

You go on ahead and assume whatever you want. I got more important shit to do rn, and I can't waste time on yet another reddit debate today. Convincing you of Christianity's correctness isn't exactly my top priority. Maybe it should be, but it isn't at the moment.

If you really want to know my core reason for believing Christianity is correct, it's because of this book. Read it, don't read it, I don't care. I think it would really challenge your worldviews, but it's rather long and intensive, and I highly doubt you'll devote that kind of time to a recommendation from a stranger on Reddit. So you see, it's really not worth getting into.

It's so strange that the same Bart Ehrman wrote a book called Did Jesus Exist?: The Historical Argument <strong>for</strong> Jesus of Nazareth

He argued that the Historical Jesus (i.e. the man, not the religious claims) existed.

I recommend Bart Ehrman's book "How Jesus Became God".

>The claim at the heart of the Christian faith is that Jesus of Nazareth was, and is, God. But this is not what the original disciples believed during Jesus’s lifetime—and it is not what Jesus claimed about himself. How Jesus Became God tells the story of an idea that shaped Christianity, and of the evolution of a belief that looked very different in the fourth century than it did in the first.

I listened to the Audible version.

How Jesus Became God: The Exaltation of a Jewish Preacher from Galilee

Unless humans haven't always written everything to appear to be either a scientific fact, or so poetic/&#8203;metaphorical/&#8203;whatever that you can make it say whatever you want. For an alternative way for how people 2500–3500 years ago would have thought about this stuff, check out John H. Walton 2009 The Lost World of Genesis One: Ancient Cosmology and the Origins Debate. As it turns out, there is exceedingly strong reason to think that you are engaged in serious anachronism.

If you want an example of something that is neither scientific fact, nor poetic/metaphorical, consider what you will encounter in Physics 101: "Consider a charged point particle hovering above an infinite sheet of uniform charge." We don't know that point particles exist, and we definitely don't think that infinite sheets exist, uniformly charged or not. And yet, that is actually a useful way to introduce people to physics. It's an idealization. Well, why can't the temptation narrative function in a similar way? Idealizations by their very nature ignore many aspects of reality, to focus your attention on a few of them, generally in a simple fashion. For example, if you make the connection that the ancient Hebrews would have, that 'nakedness' is a symbol for 'vulnerability', then you will read the temptation narrative as teaching Adam & Eve that "vulnerability is shameful". This in fact would be the only concrete "knowledge of good and evil" that Adam & Eve would have obtained. We could then ask whether it is true knowledge, or false knowledge. If it turns out that this is a powerful analytical tool for fighting evil and promoting human flourishing, the temptation narrative would serve a very important purpose. And it would serve this purpose regardless of whether it is "historically true" or "literally true" or what have you.

I thought the Second Coming would have happened around 2000. Now that it hasn't I have no idea when it will be. But life is short, so the judgement day is never far off. The best plan is to keep trying to be more like Christ - learning, growing, loving, serving.

In my mind Genesis is not a literal science or history book. It's clearly the creation story of an ancient people. That doesn't mean that the people mentioned (Adam, etc) couldn't have been real people.

A great and mind-blowing book about Genesis:

The Lost World of Genesis One: Ancient Cosmology and the Origins Debate, John H. Walton, https://www.amazon.com/Lost-World-Genesis-One-Cosmology/dp/0830837043/