The best Religious Fundamentalism books: Reddit reviews

From 3.5 billion Reddit comments

The Family

There's a good book which really dives into the deconversion process of a former missionary:

https://www.amazon.com/Why-Believed-Reflections-Former-Missionary-ebook/dp/B003UNLMRY

I read it when I was questioning my own faith (along with reading, Erhman, Price, Crossan, Meier, Sanders, etc.). And, for the record, I'm still a Christian today, but less dogmatic.

The author was raised in a conservative church, and basically was shook when he encountered challenges to what he was taught. He didn't even know these challenges existed! In my view, most churches in the US is doing a poor job of equipping people to face the real, tough questions of the Bible. Too much sheltering and holding people by the hand.

Two big issues I remember from the author's journey:

- The doctrine of most humans being tormented in hell forever

- The lousy science behind creationism

These two issues really make him shake his head at the Bible.

This thread is well timed, since I'm reading a book right now about the link between Evangelical Christianity and corrupt adoption systems, The Child Catchers by Kathryn Joyce. My husband and I decided a few years ago that we wanted to eventually adopt, but reading this is making me really rethink a lot of my assumptions about how we would go about it (and even rethink the decision to adopt period).

​

(edit: https://www.amazon.com/Child-Catchers-Rescue-Trafficking-Adoption/dp/1586489429 it's $3.99 on kindle right now!)

>What exactly do they need babies for anyway?

This 👇

“The Child Catchers takes us for a fast and frightening ride down a road to hell that’s paved with ‘good intentions,’ yes, but also with willful ignorance and worse, outright deception. Joyce’s story—that of a new, religiously driven ‘baby scoop’ that amounts to a massive redistribution of children from the poor to the affluent[.]"

"Conservative evangelicals control much of that industry through an infrastructure of adoption agencies, ministries, political lobbying groups, and publicly-supported "crisis pregnancy centers," which convince women not just to "choose life," but to choose adoption. Overseas, conservative Christians preside over a spiraling boom-bust adoption market in countries where people are poor and regulations weak, and where hefty adoption fees provide lots of incentive to increase the "supply" of adoptable children, recruiting "orphans" from intact but vulnerable families."

https://www.amazon.ca/Child-Catchers-Rescue-Trafficking-Adoption/dp/1586489429

If you want to read more about that Alex Jones incursion read:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Them-Adventures-Extremists-Jon-Ronson/dp/0330375466

No one is owed a baby. No one is obligated to provide babies. This is such unbelievable entitlement. Also, no one willingly sells their baby. There are 20 million children in poverty while only 13,000 babies are "given up" for adoption every year. This thoroughly demonstrates women are several orders of magnitude prefer to raise children in abject poverty than to have to sell them. Multiple surveys show that of woman who lost children to adoption had the option to keep a baby, they would have. The only reason women "choose" adoption is because they have zero alternatives. That's not "choice." That's coercion. During the Baby Scoop Era of the mid 20th century, hundreds of thousands of white girls and women across Europe, US, Canada and Australia were forced into trafficking their babies. Thousands of girls and women in developing countries are still forced into giving birth and trafficking babies through adoption agencies.

Baby Scoop Era https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_Scoop_Era#%3A%7E%3Atext%3DThe_Baby_Scoop_Era_was%2Chigher_rate_of_newborn_adoption.?wprov=sfla1

The Child Catchers: Rescue, Trafficking, and the New Gospel of Adoption https://www.amazon.com/dp/1586489429/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_JEKBQC0KC9PNR38K3YY1

🙄

No one willingly sells their baby. Quit trying to justify weaponizing child poverty to coerce women into human trafficking.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_Scoop_Era#%3A%7E%3Atext%3DThe_Baby_Scoop_Era_was%2Chigher_rate_of_newborn_adoption.?wprov=sfla1

The Child Catchers: Rescue, Trafficking, and the New Gospel of Adoption https://www.amazon.com/dp/1586489429/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_JEKBQC0KC9PNR38K3YY1

🙄

No one willingly sells their baby. Quit trying to justify weaponizing child poverty to coerce women into human trafficking.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_Scoop_Era#%3A%7E%3Atext%3DThe_Baby_Scoop_Era_was%2Chigher_rate_of_newborn_adoption.?wprov=sfla1

The Child Catchers: Rescue, Trafficking, and the New Gospel of Adoption https://www.amazon.com/dp/1586489429/ref=cm_sw_r_awdo_JEKBQC0KC9PNR38K3YY1

You may be interested in the book The Child Catchers by Kathryn Joyce. When you look at their motivations for adopting it’s kind of no wonder kids are having bad experiences in these homes. And as the book states, the influence of evangelical christians has permeated most corners of adoption in the States.

The evangelical mission is to serve the rich. The rich are the embodiment of the Biblical definition of the world. https://www.amazon.com/Family-Secret-Fundamentalism-Heart-American/dp/0060560053?msclkid=90835387bd8c11ecb2d146a5ab961b34

Modern evangelicals have been completely subverted by the apparition appearing to Abram Vereide in 1929. This being claimed to be Jesus Christ and gave him the mission of serving "God's Chosen People" whom he defined as the rich and powerful. With the initial backing of ten millionaires, soon expanding to 26 he founded the Fellowship Foundation, known today as "The Family". https://www.amazon.com/Family-Secret-Fundamentalism-Heart-American/dp/0060560053?msclkid=90835387bd8c11ecb2d146a5ab961b34. Everything the televangelists preach when they stand up from their solid gold designer Gucchi commodes is in contradiction to every book in the Bible.

I second the recommendation for Leaving the Fold by Dr. Marlene Winell. I took a lot of notes and still re-read some parts. It has helped me a lot with unlearning the mental and emotional conditioning.

There's a great book on them by Jeff Sharlet. https://www.amazon.com/Family-Secret-Fundamentalism-Heart-American/dp/0060560053 The Family: The Secret Fundamentalism at the Heart of ...

Honestly, I read it when it was first published and a) it was absolutely terrifying, and b) explained A LOT (i.e. where that "national prayer breakfast" came from).

"Leaving the Fold" was a helpful read for me. It's no cure, but did help me understand that I'm not alone in having trauma from my excessively religious upbringing. It's not just about the deconversion process, but also covers some of the lingering psychological effects that we face after.

Leaving the Fold by Marlene Winell is a really good one. It's not expensive but there are lots of free articles also available at her website Journey Free.

Also, I just remembered this book my small group is going through. It does a good job of walking through the basics. https://www.amazon.com/Bible-Doctrine-Essential-Teachings-Christian/dp/0310222338/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=bible+doctrine&qid=1628787357&sr=8-1

Because God can do anything and chose to become human. Philippians 2 would suggest He opted to put aside some of His divinity in a very humble way. Yeah it is hard for me to even understand that. Because humility is divine. As is glory.

But no I don’t think it’s illogical. I think it’s paradoxical. You know - “the more I’ve learned the more I don’t know.” Is that illogical? No. It just takes a second of reflection. Or does it take longer to truly appreciate?

Anyway I’m not too smart. Go read something like Wayne Grudem systematic theology. It starts, if I remember correctly, with Christology. Or maybe that’s just the part I read first. But yeh it’ll probably address most of your questions about God in a better way than Reddit. https://www.amazon.com/Systematic-Theology-Introduction-Biblical-Doctrine/dp/0310286700

Which makes me wonder- why are you here? Probably to cast doubt in the minds of Christians more than to ever learn something. Says a lot about you. Says a lot about atheism. Atheists believe this life is the only you’ll get. And you want to spend it trying to mock others? What a waste. I don’t want to mock you. I want you to find God because He’s good. Way better than I deserve or could even describe. And you can know Him! To know Jesus is to know God. Study Jesus

You could get him a book written by someone who investigates cults/extremist groups. The idea being that he'd read it and come to the conclusion that Icke's nonsense sounds similar to these other loony groups ideologies by himself.

For example, this one by Jon Ronson might be applicable.

Have you seen The Family? The book is better, but the documentary provides a good overview of where this mindset comes from.

This is quite interesting, but I think it overlooks that American Christianity has a very long history of fundamentalist revivals and apocalyptic predictions predating the 1970s. Check out Karen Armstrong's The Battle for God for a really fascinating history.

Here is an excellent systematic theology that will show you what the Bible teaches about itself. Hope this helps.

https://www.amazon.com/Systematic-Theology-Introduction-Biblical-Doctrine/dp/0310286700

So, two things.

First of all, this is in one way totally normal. It's a textbook response to grief such as death or the ending of a deeply important relationship even if that relationship is with an imaginary person. The pain is just as real, and the grief process just as necessary.

In another way, which compounds the first, the depression is abnormal and the result of substantial, consistent training that makes "being outside the cult" an emotionally distressing experience. TL;DR check out the BITE model. The Christian is infected with pervasive anxiety. End of the world, divine censor, imperfection as evidence of personal failure of character, lurking demons evidenced by happiness, proof of divine pleasure evidenced by sadness, just about everything. Then the Christian is taught soothing techniques and that these things- which are specific to the religion- is the only emotional safety because everyone else has all the same anxieties.

Because you are recently deconverted, and because you're doing so well already, I expect that talking to a therapist would be helpful for you. But if you don't feel like doing that, you may find great value in Marlene Winell's Leaving The Fold. Your experience is common. There are ways through it. You're doing very well.

There is kind of an adoption industrial complex associated with the Evangelicals and the "Pro-Life" movement. It has it's own set of problems. Kathryn Joyce wrote a book about it.

Africa and China are also well known for the child trafficking. Many of these kids have parents still alive. They are just poor villagers who are either tricked into "sending their kids to boarding school" or actually stolen. Here is a well researched book on the subject:

https://www.amazon.com/Child-Catchers-Rescue-Trafficking-Adoption/dp/1586489429/

https://www.cnn.com/2015/01/14/china/china-child-trafficking-bust/index.html

Oh, in that case I would check out Bible Doctrine by Wayne Grudem. It's pretty accessible and covers pretty much every area of Systematic Theology.

There's a book called Leaving The Fold that has a chapter or two on post-religious sexual guilt. Therapy helped me through a lot, but if it hadn't I think that book would have introduced me to the necessary concepts to start healing sexually.

Read this book:

I do fear them using some "black swan" event for power. An impending war, epidemic, etc.

https://www.amazon.com/Family-Secret-Fundamentalism-Heart-American/dp/0060560053

It is true a lot of people are standing against it.

Censuset nuk jane te sakta, por mendimi yt qenka i sakte? Mire hajt po e pranojme.

Po Kosova? SIpas definicionit tend eshte shtet mysliman.Atehere pse votojne femrat? Pse marrin patenta? Pse nuk veshin ferxhe me detyrim nga shteti? Pse dalin te pashoqeruara? Pse zgjodhen femer presidente? Pse nuk vrasin me gur ateistet?

> Ku i gjen këto shifra e fesë njëherë? Se po më çudit.

https://www.amazon.com/Beyond-Fundamentalism-Confronting-Religious-Globalization/dp/0812978307

> Që të krishterët praktikojnë FGM nuk do të thotë që s'ka lidhje me fenë myslimane.

Pike e zeze. Edhe kur te krishteret e praktikojne e kane fajin myslimanet.

Si mendon pra? A eshte FGM problem katolik? A eshte persekutimi i homoseksualeve problem katolik? Apo problem afrikan? A eshte perdhunimi i femrave ne grup problem hindu?

> Indonezia është afrikane?

?

jo

The book Why I Believed: Reflections of a Former Missionary might help.

The author has a gentle but honest approach.

Grudem is pretty helpful on this subject to define categories. Conveniently, Amazon has the relevant parts scanned, beginning on page 47.