Well, work, make things better. Optimize system.
give my best to make something useful to other people(in my case, through my software company(I'm entrepreneur), mostly) optimize systems (such as this one). I love this things.
> It’s true that democratic systems have led to the rise of awful things in the past, but do you seriously wish to compare the rap sheets of those, in your words I imagine, “sacrificed at the altar of mob rule”, to the laundry list of crimes against humanity committed in the name of kings, queens, emperors, chairmen, general secretaries, supreme leaders, Duces, and Fuhrers? Because if so, be my guest. You’ll find the numbers do not fall on your side.
The fact is the world's self-proclaimed greatest democracy, the US, has killed far more civilians than all the dictatorships combined.
You should read the book Democracy: The God That Failed and educate yourself a bit more.
yeah I expected that too later on I realized most are rather super "calm" and not that willing to engage in such big competitions and hash environment and extract most out this. I watched movies and documentaries as kid about traders and CEO in big corporations just getting shit done, in a super competitive environment and people pushing things forward, faster and faster and super excited just wanted to be like that. Someone are really like that. That "you can't live do that, that's toxic and bla bla" is just shit. I also thought we were all capitalism but also free market oriented. What's up in believing the government can do shit efficiently? pushing people down so the system can control and rob you. C'mon! It's so fucking obvious it doesn't work and without a free market, they are just preventing us to push things forward faster and more efficiently
jokes on you, entj is more likely to be libertarian than SJs, that supports democracyand some totalitarian regimes around. Sure a direct comparasion isn't fair, there are fair less entjs than any STJ type
let's build the ancapistan, I'll take my piece of land and make the rules, you do the same. We should get rid of those parasites in name of democracy robbing us, a failed system
those numbers are too high, that means people more time away from work
time to fix that, write a new constitution, end the fed, get rid of democracy, make laws based on top of justnaturalism to begun with. We need to launch a new country
These firings will not lead to any kind of difference in the US Military action, that is for sure.
We are seeing democracy working: It is failing right in front of all of us. I would highly recommend this book if you have been at least intrigued by the conversation.
Thanks for being respectful.
A libertarian perspective on Monarchy
On a note, authoritarian =/= totalitarian.
We have literally more totalitarian government in the US today by epic proportions compared to the colonial revolt. From the USSR to Nazi Germany to China and North Korea, basically the entire continents of Africa and South America, Iran, And every EU nation a libertarian would despise, democracy has been tje single most totalitarian force the world has ever seen, aka, the least libertarian.
Well it works both ways, do you know how many commies stop by to gloat about the "righteous" murder of children like of the Tsar? And literally advocate killing us Stalin style?
And you suggest squashing us out of fear we will someday squash you. Which still makes you a squasher.
And IF you are the logical end of tje ideology, then isn't it right by your same logic that you be squashed?
Also, you should really look into the difference between authoritarianism and totalitarianism. I'd invite you from a libertarian type standpoint to view:
This book I believe free online copies can be found.
Authority is a teacher. Totality is no teacher and a class run by the bully who takes your lunch money and gives wedgies. Under the teacher, you actually have far more liberty than you do under the bully and his henchmen.
Wait, you really don't know there's a large section of libertarians who are anti-democracy? Do you not know who Hans-Hermann Hoppe is? He's one of the biggest anti-democracy advocates and he's also one of the major thought leaders of ancaps. Might want to read Democracy – The God That Failed before you continue the idea that it's an authoritarian position. You don't have to agree with his arguments but you seem quite ignorant on the subject to have such a strong opinion.
> i am one of the dont tread on me guys.
Well technically a truly limited republic will be better for this than a Constitutional Monarchy, but as a general rule, more democracy = less liberty.
The USSR had universal Suffrage before the USA. Prior to the parliment system, most Monarchies in history were far more free than we are, and really the issues with the rebellion had much ado about parliment than the King, or the King in a parlimentary system.
But if you want the don't tread on me angle, here is the best way to learn:
This book, is from a libertarian perspective for Monarchy and one that I as a "Don't Tread on Me American" found quite good in my Monarchism formation.
I'm not exactly sure you can read it in german, but here is the amazon link for the english one. https://www.amazon.com/Democracy-Economics-Politics-Perspectives-Democratic/dp/0765808684/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1548623754&sr=8-1&keywords=democracy+the+god+that+failed
He has books in german too.
> Hitler was not elected, the enabling act was done without the consent of the citizenry, and the creation of Fuhrership was done without the express consent of the Reichstag. There was little to no democracy involved. The quote is wrong.
You realize that is part of the democratic process right? It is part of the ideology that the president represents the people because he was elected. He can do pretty much whatever, lest restricted by the constitution, but in democracy, the constitution is considered "living".
You need to read Anatomy of the State by Rothbard and Democracy the God that failed by Hoppe.
https://www.amazon.com/Democracy-Economics-Politics-Perspectives-Democratic/dp/0765808684
I'd Suggest you pick up Hans Herman Hoppe's book: Democracy-The God That Failed: The Economics and Politics of Monarchy, Democracy, and Natural Order He can explain it way better than I can. It's not a long or boring read, worth a trip to the library for.
> You think an individual stealing from you is better than the community of your friends and family needing to move you to build a school?
How's that even the same? And what terrible example this is. Why would someone need to build a school on my property? But yeah, even then, if I agreed to move, I should be compensated, if people simply kick me out of my home just because they have the numbers on me it's worse.
> Then the individual king gets to force his will on the collective because his individual rights are more important than everyone else.
That's a real bad interpretation. First, the "collective" is a set of individuals working together by force or self-interest, not some greater than it's parts holy and pure thing. No one's rights supercedes nobody else's, you don't force your will on nobody else's like no one can force it on you.
> That wasn't the question you disagreed with. The choice was which is worse the community forcing you or an individual forcing you.
If I'm voluntarily part of a community I'll do what I can for it's benefit. It benefits me in the end after all, if I'm a part of it it's because I think it's what's best for me. If I'm forced to be a part of a community and obey the rulings of a leader, that's a whole other thing. I actually think that it's worse than being robbed.
>You seem to prefer living under a tyrant rather than a democracy.
Interesting that you mentioned democracy in such holy light. I recommend the book Democracy: The God That Failed. It does in fact argue that a monarchy, as awful as it is, is a lesser evil, but the point is that there should be no state to begin with.
https://www.amazon.com/Democracy-God-That-Failed-Perspectives/dp/0765808684
Hans Hermann Hoppe is himself a market anarchist, but in this book he argues that democracy has fatal flaws which make it inferior to monarchy. A very short gist of his analysis is that an elected official in a democratic system has no incentive to maintain the longterm value of the country, since the official doesn't directly benefit from prudent, wise longterm policy. Rather, the overwhelming incentive is for politicians to milk the value of their power while they have it, and leave the mess for the next guy to sort out. So they buy votes by increasing pension guarantees or by creating subsidies which go into effect a few years down the line. The politician gets immediate credit, which translates into votes/support, while the bill may not come due in the form of higher taxes for many decades. Monarchy, on the other hand, allows for the ruling class to "own" the capital value of the country and to pass it on to their heirs, which gives them a much greater incentive to keep spending in check. If they destroy their economy, they only harm their own property in the long term. Historically, the 18th-19th century european monarchies were much better at maintaining balanced budgets than 20th century democracies have been.
Again, he isn't a monarchist. The point of the book is to highlight the flaws of democracy. The fact that all modernized nations carry massive debt and operate on keynesian economic principles is taken as evidence of the perverse incentives in democracy.
I don't have to imagine it. He had the power to destroy everyone on earth at the push of a button. It's true that he could only do it for 8 years, but maybe there could be a system that doesn't even give "nucular" codes to such a monster in the first place.
Here's the book whose arguments I'm referring to, by the way.
https://www.amazon.com/Democracy-God-That-Failed-Perspectives/dp/0765808684
> The reason why our government runs as a democracy with all these barriers to decision making is because it was designed to be resilient against tyrants. They prioritized THAT over peak efficiency.
Or, it was really designed to obfuscate and you're just buying the sales pitch. That is another possibility that you seem to be unwilling to explore. In time, you'll hopefully begin to question all these baseline assumptions that were baked into this system of power and control. When you do, be sure to check r/Anarcho_Capitalism, Mises Institute, etc. and also be sure to check out the following book:
"Democracy - The God That Failed"
This is the book that put the nail in the coffin for me. It is not a light read and is very theoretical but basically points out that a naturally ordered society (i.e., a society based on private property and voluntary exchange) results in a higher "utility" than a society commanded by a single person or a group of people.
The whole discussion is laughable really. When voting,you certainly shouldn't encourage the dumbest and least capable among the population to participate. It's pointless to discuss anyway though, considering that kneeling to rulers chosen by someone else is the opposite of freedom, and democracy is the god that failed.
Insert Hoppe and his argument about monarchy, that politicians have "i need to loot now, during my term" mindset, while king doesn't since he's permanent. https://www.amazon.com/Democracy-Economics-Politics-Perspectives-Democratic/dp/0765808684
Vote??? VOTE??? https://www.amazon.com/-/es/Hans-Hermann-Hoppe/dp/0765808684
nah, controversial topics are fun! for example, democracy is raw garbage attracts the worst and tax is raw theft
I'm libertarian, I believe that failed systems gets the worse in the top, is nothing but a legal plunder and the most unethical (violate natural rights and PNA systematically) and inefficient (it has to some degree economic calculation problem). I'm 8w7
Everyone says that like Feudalism is some sort of dirty word.
https://www.amazon.com/Democracy-Economics-Politics-Perspectives-Democratic/dp/0765808684
now we got democracy, it just like that but it's soft slavery
what you got in US is crony capitalism + a parasitic government, part of a failed system by design
we need to build the ancapistain all governments gets in a totalitarian regime, eventually. It's the God that failed
you need to be libertarian, democracy is garbage and doesn't work
The most efficient way is by empowering the individual, giving them freedom to chose. All that running on top of a legal system based on natural rights, as opposed to positive rights, which we do use by now. That way they can grow, we can do the best resources allocation of what we have, without a parasitary system, part of a flawed system -- the God that failed, which uses the fallacy of improving the welfare state, as excuse install a legal plunder (where poor people pay more taxes than anyone else) because that system attracts the worst, from an ethical and technical point of view. And those incompetent and unethical people are managing your resources -- literally telling you to do something which is impossible, like manage society's resources in a central government see this (democracy is a soft-socialism and therefore has same issue with the calculus problem) -- put taxes (which we don't neeed, tax is theft!) on everything making the poor have less buy power both through taxing and inflation (thanks we have Bitcoin now, which was made in response to the 2008 crises and Fed's stupidity, ~24% of all US dollars were printed in last 12 months), stupid laws such as minimum wage increase unemployment (and the law has racists roots), making literally every single product more expansive due to real lack of real free market, that cut prices down in the long run and improve the products at same time, health case is also expansive due to lack of real free market, people die due to this. Government make stupids mistakes and send people over war to die defending this legal plunder, that they do think is helping to help society when in fact it just supporting crony capitalism. And so on.. but i'm really sleepy so I'll finish here but I'm willing to answer all your questions if they are genuine, and not something like "capitalism is bad" without actually understand what capitalism is. Your being a Fi user I'm likely to like your approach even more. Now some tiny yet insightful books to get to know what's like the government:
The anatomy of state (Murray Rothbard)
What Has Government Done to Our Money? (Murray N. Rothbard)
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TD;DR: Well, becaming libertarian (in the Murrary Rothbard/Hans-hermamn hope definition) and helping to decentralize government's services into a private governance will help a lot
Anyone who wants to understand 'Democracy' should watch the following video,... or read this book: http://www.amazon.com/Democracy-God-That-Failed-Perspectives/dp/0765808684/
Hoppe is a totalitarian masquerading as an anarchist. That said, his "Democracy" is available in book form: https://www.amazon.com/Democracy-Economics-Politics-Perspectives-Democratic/dp/0765808684/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=Democracy%3A+The+God+That+Failed+Hoppe&qid=1656093801&sr=8-1.
Check the sub my guy. Not exactly fans of democracy here. Try doing some reading?
15 years ago when Ron Paul was first popular I was interested in libertarianism but quickly dropped it. This picture pretty much sums up a part of my experience during that time.
The 0.4% for Donald Trump "the most libertarian president" (/s) pretty much sums up why the tea party and all that was so easily taken over by neo and paleocons. Same guys who link me Michael Malice fans no joke link a book about how monarchy is better than democracy and republicanism.
If you don't believe me that they hold positions like that:
https://mises.org/library/libertarian-case-monarchy
https://www.amazon.com/Democracy-Economics-Politics-Perspectives-Democratic/dp/0765808684
Heres a few good books:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Democracy-Economics-Politics-Perspectives-Democratic/dp/0765808684
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/51877.Capitalism_and_Freedom
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/25182012-a-short-history-of-man
https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/168857.A_Theory_of_Socialism_and_Capitalism
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Actionable-Gamification-Beyond-Points-Leaderboards/dp/1511744049
Democracy – The God That Failed: The Economics and Politics of Monarchy, Democracy and Natural Order (Perspectives on Democratic Practice) https://www.amazon.com/dp/0765808684/ref=cm_sw_r_apan_glt_i_60JXXR56D5FXY7GDWFN4
Hans-Hermann Hoppe wrote about that short time-preference in Democracy: The God that Failed. He shows that monarchy has the longest time-preference.
Libertarian Monarchism is not uncommon. Here's some articles I sent to my friend before, one by the main man himself the Mad Monarchist and another from the Mises Institute:
http://madmonarchist.blogspot.com/2014/06/libertarian-monarchy.html?m=1
https://mises.org/library/libertarian-case-monarchy
Other than having to read those walls of text, Hans-Hermann Hoppe sums up the compatibility by demonstrating how under a monarch the government itself would be "private." He states that a "public" government in which those who are elected are in power are less taken care of, since aspects of these people's lives are unaffected by their terms (financial decisions, debt, etc.) they do not care as much as a monarch would and are more likely to make reckless choices. On the other hand, a monarch would obviously take care of their country since they are head of state for life and their own choices effect almost everything in their life. This is one of many examples of why monarchy would be preferable over democracy by Hoppe and he has written a book about too titled Democracy, The God That Failed. If you're interested in I will leave an Amazon link here too:
Democracy: The God That Failed: The Economics and Politics of Monarchy, Democracy, and Natural Order https://www.amazon.ca/dp/0765808684/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_i_RQH672FR7NNY988W501J
people cheat on their taxes and hide their money because it's theft. It isn't part of human nature to accept someone rob your stuff. That simple. "oh but democracy" it's just legal plunder. Democracy is the God that failed. "oh, the poor, without government they fucked" NO, they are better off without them, "oh without government it's nothing but mess" again NO, we're better off without them. "oh, without government = monopoly, big techs would run the world" hell no
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Failed God in the sense that people seems to believe democracy is going to solve their problems like God would. That's also the title of this book
Democracy is intrinsically at odds with libertarianism.
One starting point is to check out this book
things gets alot better if we let the spontaneuos order do its thing in a society based on natural rights and argumentation ethics because like-minded are going to team up, hence diminishing largely the conflicts in groups. Nowadays this isn't possible due to a failed system having monopoly on decision making, totally incompatible with human nature and ending up with a crony capitalism. Some ongoing decentralized systems is going to fix alot of those issues
That system doesn't really works well at all, one of them
capitalism in the sense of pure free market = anarcho-capitalism, it's part of spontaneuors order and division of labour. It doesn't "fail", it gets used as long people are free. in that system people doesn't "vote", it's part of a failed system, they have their own piece of land and associate with whoever they want, city A, B, C doesn't really matter...
totally agree, I see Si like a trap function. In fact, it's one of the functions that seems to be the reason people support a system such as this desperately trading freedom by security, putting their lives in the hands of an imposed authority hoping to that authority take care of their lives. They also just want to stand themselves in some authority. They also seem to think something is true or not by repetition, the more the see/hear it, the more likely they are going to internalize this as true. They result isn't hard to see: someone will pretend to be that authority, claim they are going things to make life previsible where this is not really possible (e.g., most of positive laws, the FED, laws to control economy (as opposed of free market, which is more based on spontaneuos order and natural rights). And just use and control them. Hence, the worse get to the top.
> Libertarians seek governance that does not use or uses minimal force, even democratic force. A great many anarchists and libertarians, left and right, have been anti-democracy
LMFAO, I'm more of a "libertarian" than you will ever be. Kropotkin and Proudhon are the only "real libertarians". I love Kropotkin and Proudhon. Social Activists in Anarcho communists groups advocate participatory democracy, direct Action, and direct Democracy.
> Anarcho-communism,[1][2][3][4][5] also known as anarchist communism,[a] is a political philosophy and anarchist school of thought which advocates the abolition of the state, capitalism, wage labour, social hierarchies[18] and private property (while retaining respect for personal property, along with collectively-owned items, goods and services)[19] in favor of common ownership of the means of production[20][21] and direct democracy as well as a horizontal network of workers' councils with production and consumption based on the guiding principle "From each according to his ability, to each according to his needs".[22][23] Some forms of anarcho-communism such as insurrectionary anarchism are strongly influenced by egoism and radical individualism, believing anarcho-communism to be the best social system for the realization of individual freedom.[24][25][26][27] Most anarcho-communists view anarcho-communism as a way of reconciling the opposition between the individual and society
David Graeber, Kropotkin, and Murray Bookchin advocate for Participatory Democracy.
Murray Rothbard, and Hans Herman Hoppe, hate democracy for the same reasons that fascists hate democracy.
This is a book by white supremacist Libertarian Hans Herman Hoppe:
https://www.amazon.com/Democracy-Economics-Politics-Perspectives-Democratic/dp/0765808684
​
Hans Herman Hoppe and other Libertarian Nazis think that people are too stupid to govern themselves. They think that the State protects the weak. They think that the strong will survive sans the Stizzlestate. Hitler and Mussolni were very anti welfare state, as were Ronald Reagan, Augusto Pinochet, and Margaret Thatcher.
​
Hitler murdered disabled peopled to save the State money.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aktion_T4
​
​
Lysander wanted mass privation with the ultra rich having insane power. Lysander Spooner was a Liberthoritarian compared to Kropotkin. Lysander Spooner wanted privatization into the hands of large corporations.
Governments, fiat coin, etc collapses always. The system is unsustainable in the long run. Government are just legal plunders. But this time, when the governments around the globe blow up alot of decentralized services, with help of blockchain technologies, will emerge and suppressing of spontaneuos order will likely die out and true free market is likely to be used, getting rid of crony capitalism
almost support of democracy, lmao
support democracy; yes, sensors
I'd say that's spontaneuos order and democracy is garbage either
why it's poorly run, they even managed to make democracy
Democracy over promises and way under delivers. Here is a thought provoking take on why democracy isn’t even better than monarchy
https://www.amazon.com/-/es/Hans-Hermann-Hoppe/dp/0765808684
If you're genuinely curious, there's a whole school of thought dedicated to this called Neoreaction. Here's a few names to look into:
right away we could get rid of democracy, since it doesn't works and build the ancapistan. Democracy and inefficiency are same thing
nah, private property!!! capitalism! this isn't the God that failed
In case of rules of democracy, they it's just a legal plunder part of failed system run by the worst.
For those that still believe in democracy, check this out
they believe in socialism and democracy(failed), to begun with. lmao
Try implement this then have a society in lethargy. Also, neither does democracy. The worse get to the top and you think they will help you LOL, manage the resources better than the market! In democracy, you'll help build a legal plunder then have a crony captalism and ask for X politican to solve the problem won't, will ask for more money, blame A, B, C and the circle repeats!
well, neither does democracy lol
SJs sustain democracy, the God that failed
sorry IXFX socialism doesn't work
neither does democracy
more info here.
Have a good night y'all, enjoy your life while you aren't in one my labs
Democracy, you say?
https://www.amazon.com.br/Democracy-God-That-Failed-Economics/dp/0765808684
https://mises.org/library/introduction-democracy-god-failed
ill start with this and see where it gets me.
judging from amazon reviews, I don't think itll do anything good reading the book, as I disagree with monarchy and his preference for aristocracy.
What people thing are made by sensor is spontaneus order and the system they think keeps society is the failed God. Bad job everywhere!
Doug is an ancap buddy, and democracy is a MASSIVE sham. I can't illustrate to you how much it is. Read Democracy the god that failed by Hoppe.
https://www.amazon.com/Democracy-Economics-Politics-Perspectives-Democratic/dp/0765808684
Or perhaps we should entertain the possibility that democracy is not such a great thing.
I highly recommend this if you haven't already read it.
Have you ever taken statistics? Have you ever seen or used a pie chart?
If every reddit account EVER CREATED voted for Jill Stein -instead of Obama- he would lose ~2% of the popular vote.
In fact, if humanity is truly this vast and stupid then I should just stop trying.
Nothing on this earth will ever be perfect, but democracy is one of the worst forms of what we have had. Hans-Hermann Hoppe did whole book on the topic.
https://www.amazon.com/Democracy-Economics-Politics-Perspectives-Democratic/dp/0765808684