This is the syllogism they are using.
A) Black people use this social program B) Republicans want to cut this social program
Therefore, Republicans want to cut social programs because Black people use them.
So if you want to cut welfare you hate black people. If you point out that the large majority of people who use welfare in America are not black, so why you hear, "DIBRPORITONALLHY BLACK." These people have no idea what a proportion is or what it should mean. Ask someone, "What is the proper proportion that something should be of another thing?" They have no idea and can't unpack it.
Bonus points, if instead of talking about disproportionate black people they instead say "people of color" you can ask them how they got so racist that they would use an old-timey racist phrase like "colored people" AND lump in all races into one group as if Cubans, and Italians, and Arabs and Indians and African Americans and Koreans are all the same, have no special identity that matters to them and their only feature is not being white. Sounds like a white supremacist talking point, doesn't it?
Edit: People should actually just read this book instead of launching misinformed and unrelated arguments against what I said. It turns out the professional academic goes into a little more detail and cites extensive sources, unlike my exceedingly brief reddit comment. Literally, go read a book. It's very short, because half of it is citations.
Discrimination and Disparities https://www.amazon.com/dp/1541645634/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_4kCuFb699QVY1
Her entire argument is trashed by a much more intelligent man than her. Thomas Sowell is the boss when it comes to these topics.
Quote him and watch them call him a racist. Then drop a picture of him. 😂
Thomas Sowell is a world class economist, I’d take his words over Wikipedia. He taught at Stanford and almost all his research was in disparities.
Boston Fed couldn’t find it:
> However, the strong correlation between race and neighborhood makes it difficult to distinguish the impact of geographic discrimination from the effects of racial discrimination. Previous studies have failed to untangle these two influences, in part, because of severe omitted variable bias. The data set in this paper allows the distinct effects of race and geography to be identified, and it shows that the evidence for redlining is weak.
All you have to do to prove redlining is show they have a lower default rate. Blacks do not, in fact they have a much higher default rate (usually 60-75% higher)
>Our analysis confirms the results of previous analyses of Federal Housing Authority mortgages: Black households have higher marginal default rates, controlling for differences in borrower and property characteristics. Further, we do not find that Black borrowers have significantly more home equity. These results do not provide evidence of racial discrimination in mortgage lending
https://ideas.repec.org/a/jre/issued/v18n21999p279-290.html
Your point about historic redline is flawed. You assume that the red line was because of race. It was correlation, not causation. They didn’t “redline” the area because it was black, they redlined it because it had a higher probability of default. It just so happened that it was predominantly a black neighborhood.
Discrimination and Disparities https://www.amazon.com/dp/1541645634/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_Q7ZeFbHRBT37P
Lol. So I have to do all your homework now, and educate you out of your own ignorance. Then, when I give you indisputable evidence, you can attack the source all while avoiding the very point I'm making: Your logic would force you to conclude there should be fewer Jews in Hollywood because they are overrepresented and overrepresentation is inherently racist. I'll play along for awhile.
https://www.jstor.org/stable/1455593
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/film/filmblog/2008/dec/23/jews-hollywood-film
https://www.amazon.com/Discrimination-Disparities-Thomas-Sowell/dp/1541645634
Certainly. Here is a few links for you:
- Pay gap analysis:
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/the-gender-pay-gap-is-a-complete-myth/
https://www.manhattan-institute.org/html/gender-wage-gap-myth-3786.html
https://www.cnbc.com/2019/03/04/google-found-its-underpaying-some-men-as-it-studies-wage-equity.html
- On domestic abuse:
https://brandongaille.com/22-important-male-victims-of-domestic-violence-statistics/
https://www.leicestershirevillages.com/are-men-more-likely-to-be-victoms-of-violent-crime/
https://www.saveservices.org/2019/02/men-face-31-greater-risk-of-domestic-violence-than-women/
- On representation quotas, I would suggest you read "Discriminations and Disparities" by Thomas Sowell (https://www.amazon.com/Discrimination-Disparities-Thomas-Sowell/dp/1541645634), as he goes in-depth into the economic effects of affirmative action in the US.
​
While not in my original comment, I would like to recommend a few other links that may be relevant to this discussion, as they help to explain why the reverse situation (women out-earning men by a statistically significant margin) is either already here or will soon be:
Women Outnumber Men In US Colleges - https://collegenews.org/women-outnumber-men-in-us-colleges-nearly-60-of-students-in-2020-21-were-women/#:~:text=Women%20Outnumber%20Men%20In%20US%20Colleges%20%E2%80%93%20Nearly%2060%25%20Of%20Students,In%202020%2F21%20Were%20Women&text=Women%20students%20now%20represent%20the,organization%2C%20the%20National%20Student%20Clearinghouse.
Dating gap - https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2015/nov/10/dating-gap-hook-up-culture-female-graduates
I hope the links provided help you to see where I'm coming from. The world is quite an ugly place, full of injustices. And the cruelty of this world does not discriminate when causing pain to all human race.
While I certainly didn't have time to read all of that (you didn't either...wokes rarely do) I did read enough to see that there were very little actual disparities in the few I was able to read. I agree that there's a 5-10% cost of racism and we should work toward getting rid of that. But CRT posits that everything is racist and must be changed. That would be bad for everyone, including black people.
As a counter, I offer https://www.amazon.com/Discrimination-Disparities-Thomas-Sowell/dp/1541645634
I'm also a big fan of John McWhorter https://www.nytimes.com/2021/11/09/opinion/critical-race-theory.html?searchResultPosition=3
As a mediocre American, you are about as unqualified to speak on either of these topics as a human being could possibly be.
Book links were not sent for you to counter in a reply. They were provided in case you, or anyone reading this, would like to go deeper into the topic/data. Our back in forth communication with links to articles is a good starting point to try and dig into what reality is but a book with years, or a lifetime of research, is much more effective/useful. Unfortunately the media does a great job of manipulating data and swaying popular opinion with misleading headlines and biased/misleading articles to push a grand narratives and make money. Books are the most useful antidote. Again, if anyone is interested, what I consider the two most important book links are below.
​
Thomas Sowell should be a house hold name. Man is a genius. Discrimination and Disparities by Thomas Sowell...
​
Data, data and more data. Facing Reality by Charles Murray...
In the African slave trade (lets say approx. 1500s-1800s), there were potentially as many as 1-1.5 million white, European enslaved laborers taken to Africa (source: Sowell's Discrimination and Disparities) - most of this occurred before and just as the North American Slave Trade was starting. Now this number, despite being high, is still significantly smaller than the 10-14 million African enslaved laborers brought to North America.
And that number pales in comparison to the estimated 40 million humans currently living in enslaved conditions with ~71% are women used in some form of human/sex trafficking.
TLDR; slavery was and continues to be rampant.
btw this can depend on who you're talking about.
Look at who we held down, and how they are next to their closest control group.
Compare African Americans to Africans. Compare Indians now to those in the past, or compare to uncontacted tribes which still exist. Who would be more likely to wish to trade places? African Americans or Africans?
One of my people, now laid off, was from Pakistan. Arranged marriage, etc. It wasn't all peaches and rainbows, but they made it very clear to me they considered English occupation to be a good thing overall. Without it they wouldn't have infrastructure now, is what they told me. Very educated people.
Another thing to compare. African American vs 1st generation African immigrant work ethic etc.
I only bring these things up because what you say does not stand up to basic scientific scrutiny.
You should read some Thomas Sowell. I highly recommend it. You're a smart guy but I don't think you've looked in to it past the main talking points. Understandable, you're very busy.
#1 in several topics. Only 320 pages. https://www.amazon.com/Discrimination-Disparities-Thomas-Sowell/dp/1541645634/ I haven't read it yet tbh but it's on my list.
The following is a copy of the original post to record the post as it was originally written.
Quoted from who knows where
> Colorblindness and equality can't be racist, and discrepancies in cases where it seems like it has something to do with racism is you simply showing how inherently racist you yourself are, because you think in terms of race and nothing else. It couldn't possibly be due to things like culture, religion, or the fact that the majority of black people live in urban areas or the south, which often are in general lacking available treatment or doctors due to being located in poorer parts of the country compared to rural or suburban areas, or anything else like that, in your opinion, because you are a racist and you only see peoples inherent skin color but your own self loathing shows in the way that you are racist, against yourself. You think doctors are inherently racist because you cant possibly imagine someone not seeing color, because you are a racist. A good example is how alot of leftists think that voter ID laws are bad, because black people are too stupid in their leftists minds to be able to get an ID. Its all part of the same white savior complex. "everyone who isn't white is so poor and incapable of doing anything and I need to help them because everyone thinks the way I do and some people who think the way I do have bad intentions". As a first generation American i find it so annoying when white Americans like you think everyone else is so poor and helpless and need a hand out, its honestly insulting every time it happens because it shows how racist people like that are. But whenever a minority does well in something, like jews in banking and media or Asians in medicine and mathematics, all of a sudden we need "affirmative action" which ends up hurting minorities who do well in those fields. Its gross in my opinion. Just let black people be successful in what they want to be successful in, and let Asians be successful in what they want to be successful in. If black people don't want to be doctors, don't force them. If they happen to live in poorer areas, maybe focus on class related issues instead of race related issues, because I guarantee that socio-economic class has more to do with these discrepancies than any sort of past racism. Stop incentivizing single parenthood in black and other poor families, and stop getting them into welfare traps. Then you'll solve this problem.
> Also, Maybe read what an actual black person has to say about this issue:
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Youre entire argument is flawed. Its based on the assumption that these effects are somehow in relation to past racism, when in fact its due to a multitude of other factors. If past racism somehow was a problem, how come black people disproportionately outnumber other races in sports like football and basketball even when they were discriminated against in those sports for ages? Or how come black people disproportionately outnumber other races in terms of music in america? Or even jews for example, who have been discriminated against in schools since they "disproportionately received higher education" and prevented from going to college, after that affirmative action was stopped they proceeded to do very well in colleges.
The issue you are describing has more to do with socio-economic status, culture, and religion rather than race. Getting black people out of welfare traps and preventing single parenthood in black families for instance would do magnitudes more to solve this problem compared to your idea of being racist to cure racism.
Colorblindness and equality can't be racist, and discrepancies in cases where it seems like it has something to do with racism is you simply showing how inherently racist you yourself are, because you think in terms of race and nothing else. It couldn't possibly be due to things like culture, religion, or the fact that the majority of black people live in urban areas or the south, which often are in general lacking available treatment or doctors due to being located in poorer parts of the country compared to rural or suburban areas, or anything else like that, in your opinion, because you are a racist and you only see peoples inherent skin color but your own self loathing shows in the way that you are racist, against yourself. You think doctors are inherently racist because you cant possibly imagine someone not seeing color, because you are a racist. A good example is how alot of leftists think that voter ID laws are bad, because black people are too stupid in their leftists minds to be able to get an ID. Its all part of the same white savior complex. "everyone who isn't white is so poor and incapable of doing anything and I need to help them because everyone thinks the way I do and some people who think the way I do have bad intentions". As a first generation American i find it so annoying when white Americans like you think everyone else is so poor and helpless and need a hand out, its honestly insulting every time it happens because it shows how racist people like that are. But whenever a minority does well in something, like jews in banking and media or Asians in medicine and mathematics, all of a sudden we need "affirmative action" which ends up hurting minorities who do well in those fields. Its gross in my opinion. Just let black people be successful in what they want to be successful in, and let Asians be successful in what they want to be successful in. If black people don't want to be doctors, don't force them. If they happen to live in poorer areas, maybe focus on class related issues instead of race related issues, because I guarantee that socio-economic class has more to do with these discrepancies than any sort of past racism. Stop incentivizing single parenthood in black and other poor families, and stop getting them into welfare traps. Then you'll solve this problem.
Also, Maybe read what an actual black person has to say about this issue:
Racism and institutional racism are not the same things. You are conflating the two. Ive never made the argument that racism doesn't exist or that its not a problem.
"But do share your video of one man who suits your argument. I am sure it clears all of the above up just perfectly in your mind."
Its a comprehensive multi factor analysis of the success or failure of various ethnic groups all over the world. Its mirrored by multiple independent researchers, its not "one mans opinion". The work done over decades (its been ongoing since long before the video was made in the 80s) demonstrates that race and discrimination have almost no impact of the outcomes of any given group.
Institutional racism: "The collective failure of an organization to provide an appropriate and professional service to people because of their color, culture, or ethnic origin. It can be seen or detected in processes, attitudes and behavior that amount to discrimination through prejudice, ignorance, thoughtlessness, and racist stereotyping which disadvantage minority ethnic people." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institutional_racism
If institutional racism were real its effects would be measurable, only when measurements are made they end up eliminating institutional racism as a significant contribution. Never mind that every sizeable organization in the country have policies in place to directly address racism and discrimination.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxH1pCZi4jw
The current edition of the book discussed in the video (new title) https://www.amazon.com/Discrimination-Disparities-Thomas-Sowell/dp/1541645634/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=discrimination+and+disparities&qid=1597352252&sr=8-1
(For what its worth I couldn't link the video previously because I cant reach youtube at work.) But frankly... your refusal to even attempt to watch the video in good faith tells everyone a lot about your character. I'm going to the effort here on the extremely slim off chance someone whos actually interested in the information stumbles onto this conversation.
No we aren’t.
Because there is no evidence for it.
Discrimination and Disparities https://www.amazon.com/dp/1541645634/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_07XkFbWH45J58
Thomas Sowell is mentioned in the OP source, but the specific works he addresses minimum wage specifically and empirically are:
Discrimination and Disparities
I'm 99% sure that's the correct citations.
Discrimination and Disparities https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/1541645634/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_4JHeFb5GZHJ29
Very good book on this subject (mainly focused on USA, but there’s a lot of info about Britain in there).
Feel free to check out any of his books which cite his work.
https://www.tsowell.com/
https://www.amazon.com/Discrimination-Disparities-Thomas-Sowell/dp/1541645634
Although, the more I do my own electronics technical research, the less weight I put on the peer-reviewed system. Most papers I find lack enough information to duplicate the work, or typos are so abundant, making it impossible to do so.