What is Reddit's opinion of Out of the Shadows: Understanding Sexual Addiction?

From 3.5 billion Reddit comments

Have you both read Out of the Shadows: Understanding Sexual Addiction https://www.amazon.com/dp/1568386214/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_fabc_MZHW7FZWN0WQHSJ9CPXM ? I found it helpful in terms of understanding what I was doing.

I can offer suggestions later. I’m waiting for a thing to start at work right now.

He is gaming for 10 hours a day, the gaming is interfering with his ability to be intimate with you, and he is accusing you of being the addict? Speaking as an addict, he couldn't be more wrong if he tried. He is playing on an insecurity there, go read Out of the Shadows to understand more about what sex addiction really is, it isn't just having a high sex drive. You are seeking out intimacy with your partner, and trying to connect with him. Nothing you described sounds like compulsive behavior. That is not addict behavior. He, on the other hand is investing a lot of time in his habit, inappropriately, and it is interfering with his relationship with you. He is defensive about it, and had mood swings when interrupted. He is dependent on his game to regulate his mood.

One thing about covid that has been good, it has revealed a lot of on-line resources. You can do couples counseling on-line, and there are affordable and even free resources if you spend some time looking. I think video game addiction is a really difficult one to deal with. Addicts have to hit bottom to realize they have a problem, and for a lot of addicts, getting broken up with can be a way to hit bottom, but for gaming addicts the break up doesn't seem to be much of an eye opener. They just see it as more time for the thing that makes them happy. It's not your job to fix him. If he wants help, sure, help, but he isn't asking.

I wonder if he’s thinking both things. On the one hand, she may be helpful and sympathetic. He may feel like you are safe to talk to this about for a whole bunch of possible reasons. And at the same time, maybe if he tells you about it, you are overcome by passion and all your clothes fall off. As the other person commented, he has watched too much porn, and maybe some long ago moment you don’t even remember has burned into his sexual fantasies. I suspect it happened in that treehouse.

If you want to help, there are 12 step programs that he can go to. He can attend one on line today, less than an hour from now. He can take an on line screening test. He could start reading Out of the Shadows: Understanding Sexual Addiction https://www.amazon.com/dp/1568386214/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_a9UdFbEVNQGTS on his kindle. There are reddit support groups too. There’s a lot of help out there for him, but he has to want help. You can’t fix him. If you want to support him you can do that. Plenty of reading you can do to understand what he might be dealing with. Keep in mind though, he could be sexualizing every little thing. I’d bet any amount of money he has masturbated thinking of you. If he is an addict, his urges can be compulsive and overpowering. Don’t go to places like that treehouse. Don’t give in “just a little”. It won’t be just a little. You need to protect yourself. You will be protecting him too. He doesn’t need to hit bottom by having sex with his cousin, or by raping you. It would be a cliche “hit bottom” story.

Good luck, this sounds like scary stuff. For both of you.

You are going to get a lot of hate and very little help here. Your story does sound very fucked up and I’m going to say something unpopular. It was brave of you to post it. It sounds like a cry for help.

If you are ready to get some help, I have a suggestion for you. Out of the Shadows: Understanding Sexual Addiction https://www.amazon.com/dp/1568386214/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_.-hbFb92HZEME If you own a kindle, or have a device that you can read kindle books on, you can start reading it in ten minutes, otherwise amazon can get it to you tomorrow. Nothing excuses what you’ve done, but understanding it is part of change.

You have opened your eyes to your own mistakes. It’s so much easier to pretend everything is ok, you didn’t do it, she didn’t understand blah blah blah. Keep your eyes open. Focus on the problem. Fix it. You can’t change the past but you can change the future.

Start by reading "Out of the Shadows: Understanding Sexual Addiction" . Seek a CSAT certified therapist. Consider a 12-step sex addiction group, or at least any outlets where you can talk about your feelings and acting out behaviors face-to-face. Bring it out of the darkness and into the light with other people, believe me it helps dissolve the power of your addiction. Keep a journal to evaluate how your recovery is going. Its slow going in the start but just begin building your tools to stay sober so later you can lean on them. I know a lot of people rely on reddit for the whole of their recovery, but it will be a lot more effective if you seek as many sources of support as possible. You can do this and your happiness, health, and life are worth the effort to change :) Wishing you luck

Understanding what we're dealing with really helps.

SO does the company of recovering addicts. Are there any SAA groups close by? I go to one, but it's a long drive, so I don't get there as often as I would like. But the Fellowship is good, and they meet in a church.

Questions are a good thing! :)

For additional reading, anything by Patrick Carnes is recommended: http://www.amazon.com/Out-Shadows-Understanding-Sexual-Addiction/dp/1568386214

Porn addiction, ironically, isn't really about the orgasm or sex act. Just like sex addiction isn't about the sex. It is about using the behavior to regulate their emotions. Much like a drug addict or alcoholic uses a substance to regulate their emotions.

Addiction is the disease, the substance or behavior is the mechanism of choice. Some people become addicted to porn, sex, food, gambling, heroin, alcohol, etc.

So, person feels bad but doesn't have the coping skills to make themselves feel better, they act out (watch porn and masturbate, gamble, eat, etc.) and they temporarily feel better. Almost immediately after is guilt and shame which cycles back to feeling bad and the cycle repeats.

Some porn addicts who are far into their addiction will have difficulty having sexual relations with a real person. The reason for this is because porn addiction (and sex addiction) isn't about sex. It is about intimacy. These addictions are really intimacy disorders. They are about deficits within the addict, just like any other addiction.

It is very fascinating stuff but heartbreaking and lonely for the spouses or partners of sex/porn addicts.

Hi, no. Out of the Shadows by Dr Patrick Carnes

I am here to support the suggestion of exploring the idea of sex addiction. It is a complex subject, and it's not what most of us think it is. You can read this book https://www.amazon.com/Out-Shadows-Understanding-Sexual-Addiction/dp/1568386214 for more information. If it is relevant to you, there are a lot of resources available to help you, and your BS.

OP, your wife will need help coping with this. Read that again a few times until it sinks in. You have no idea what you have done to her. You can't make it better by hiding any of it, that just makes it worse. You also won't make it better by beating yourself up, or making huge romantic gestures. The only things you can do are be completely honest, learn how to support her, and work on understanding and changing yourself.

He needs to seek help. What you said about this is his coping mechanism for when he is sad, there's a word for that. That's addiction. I say this as an addict. When I don't know how to cope with my emotions, my brain turns to sex. Real sex, porn, on-line, purely mental fantasy, it's all a relief from stress. I am developing other ways to cope, but that's what an addict is. Go read https://www.amazon.com/Out-Shadows-Understanding-Sexual-Addiction/dp/1568386214 and think about if this represents your WS in some ways. He's not the wildly dangerous or illegal addict, but he is in the addiction cycle, from what you describe. Try to convince him to read it. If he will read my response right here, that might be good too.

So good news for him about addiction. Yes, there will be a push towards sobriety. No more jerking it to internet porn and chats when he feels sad. However, sobriety is not chastity. Sobriety can lead the two of you closer together in more and better sexual ways. If he approaches this seriously, gets his shit in control, he can have more and better sex. He has a huge advantage over a lot of addicts. He has you, you sound supportive. If you are working with him in treatment, and if he wants to get better, he can. You can even talk about healthy honest outlets that include porn, or even on-line chatting if YOU are ok with those things in the right, honest, context. I am in recovery, I am not fucking up any more, and I am actively looking for a sexting partner with my wife's consent and approval. Another option would be for you and him to sext, from across the house, if you have interest in that. Or not, but you two can get honest about all this stuff.

Therapy is only about divorce if that's the direction you want to go. A therapist is not an obligation. If he goes to a therapist and they say "you need a divorce and you need to be celibate for a year" he can say "thanks for your input, we don't need to schedule another session, bye!" Better still he can talk to the therapist before scheduling a session. Tell them that he wants to work on reconciliation and addictive behavior without celibacy and ask them how they will approach that in therapy. If he doesn't like their answer, "ok thanks for your time, I need to go think about it" and call someone else. Honestly it's best if he talks to a therapist or two before picking one. The connection is vital. I like my therapist, if he wasn't my therapist I would invite him to games night. Also, he doesn't have to get into detail with his therapist. I was worried I would have to disclose the exact kinky stuff I talked about on-line. Nope, not a thing. "I'm uncomfortable getting into any more detail here" is a valid answer. And, get a male therapist. The last thing he needs is an attractive female therapist to talk to about sex.

Oh, and from what you say, you should consider participating in a spouses group. Everyone in the group will know what you are going through, every last one of them has been cheated on. You can talk about all of your troubles with no shame at all. No one will be shocked. They all understand what it means to want to stay with an addict and help them heal.

Addiction is such a complex thing. Especially sex related addictions. I would strongly suggest you both do research on the subject, and share resources you find that you think are relevant. A great starting place is https://www.amazon.com/Out-Shadows-Understanding-Sexual-Addiction/dp/1568386214/ it isn't porn specific but it has a lot of insight into sex addiction. There's sex addiction, love addiction, porn addiction, fantasy addiction, and combinations of all that. Sex and love for me.

If he thinks he might be "somewhat" addicted, he really needs to explore that thought. It's not a simple thing, or black and white, addicted or not addicted. I would suggest that he talk to a therapist who is certified in handling sex addiction. Look for someone who uses the acronym CSAT (Certified Sex Addiction Therapist). General therapists aren't equipped to help. Some will tell that sex addiction isn't a thing, others will have him on no porn, no sex, no intimacy at the first meeting, and none of that is helpful. Good news for him, dealing with sexual addictions doesn't have to mean celibacy, or completely abstaining from porn forever. It might mean no more porn ever, Im not saying that's not possible but it's not the only way to deal with it. A lot of anti-porn groups take a very simplistic approach, and that may not be helpful at all. For some people it is, but for others it's a barrier to getting help. If it feels like a barrier, don't work with those groups. The encouraging thing here is that he can learn to identify his problematic behavior and avoid that behavior.

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It sounds like there's something to talk about around the subject of redheads specifically. Addiction is a way of dealing with negative feelings. Guilt and shame come up a lot. You say he has acted out with redheads in the past? In addiction, as I understand it, the pattern would be, he starts to feel guilt and shame about something, maybe about misdeeds with past redheads. His emotions are not something he can cope with, so he distracts himself with fantasies and then porn, in this case focusing on that topic. He will build that up to acting out, in this case, secretly masturbating to redhead porn. The thing that makes this a nasty cycle is, as soon as he is done, he knows that he's done something bad, that you feel hurt about. That's guilt and shame that he can't cope with. Go back to the beginning of the process and repeat, over and over, more intensely each time. He can break the cycle. It's not easy but he can. The more support he has, the better, and it sounds like you want to provide support. So that's good.

Look up the video for the TED talk about the opposite of addiction, or maybe "everything you know about addiction is wrong". It can be really helpful dealing with this stuff.

As another poster said, welcome to one of the worst clubs out there. As a WS and an SA, I understand what your WS said about feeling relieved. I was in a lot of denial, and was very compartmentalized. Looking back, I can't understand how I had myself so effectively deceived. I thought I was comfortable and honest and everything was ok, but I was also feeling a lot of stress and generalized anxiety. Now I really am honest, when I am tempted, when I have thoughts, I talk to my wife. When I have feelings I can't identify, I talk to my wife. I don't have secrets anymore, and it is a huge relief. I have stress, but that stress is because I am still broken, I have guilt, I have shame, but I don't have secrets and I do have a ton of support.

If the "expert" has you on a list, keep looking. Therapists and counselors who work with this kind of issue are very aware that you are in crisis, and you can't wait. If they don't have time for a pre-intake talk this week, and an appointment no later than next week, they aren't going to be able to serve your needs effectively. That person is just another professional providing a service. If a plumber put you on a list for your leaking pipes, you would keep calling until you found someone ready to jump in his truck and come help with the problem. This is a broken pipe, it needs attention right now. My suggestion is that you don't need one professional, you need three. One for the marriage, one for him and his addiction, and one for you and your grief and trauma. That's what this is, grief and trauma. The pain you are feeling is "normal", that is what happens, unfortunately. Your WS may not comprehend this yet, but your pain is going to be front and center for months. His relief is trivial compared to your pain. He may feel like "I was honest, I told her, that part is over", but no, it's not over.

You feel normal one minute and triggered the next because your mind wants to protect you. You want to fall into the normal rhythms of life and go back to "normal". Then you remember, and it's back if your face and it hurts again. When he starts to understand that, he may find (if he's like me) that he gained that "clarity" at the cost of a lot of guilt, and hopefully he will also figure out that the guilt doesn't matter, it's not about him anymore, it's about you, and your pain. Disclosing was the first step, he has a lot of hard work to do supporting you. If you share this response with him, I'm here to tell him, he needs to keep his focus on you. He can't shut down your feelings by beating himself up. He won't help by wallowing in guilt, shame, grief, and fear (of losing you). He can acknowledge those feelings, and when you are ready he can express and explore them, but for now, if he want to help he needs to sit with you while you have these feelings, and he needs to work on a real apology. The key a real apology is understanding what he did and never doing it again, it's not about the words it's about the actions.

One more thought, here's a reading recommendation for him and maybe you Out of the Shadows I read most of it in one sitting, while my wife was taking a nap. It motivated me, helped me understand some, and pointed out that what I thought was normal, isn't.

show him this book:

https://www.amazon.com/Out-Shadows-Understanding-Sexual-Addiction/dp/1568386214

Actually - a book I'd forgotten about - all this kind of stuff is explained if you read this:

http://www.amazon.com/Out-Shadows-Understanding-Sexual-Addiction/dp/1568386214

Plus:

http://www.amazon.com/Sex-Addicts-Anonymous/dp/0976831317

This one's pretty good, too:

http://www.amazon.com/Healing-Shame-Binds-Recovery-Classics/dp/0757303234

I've been so deep in the fetish I forgot I already knew the answer to how to get out of it.

you might like to read this

and you might like to cross post here - https://www.reddit.com/r/SEXAA/?

You're not alone.

I found relief through working the 12 steps from my sex addiction. I pray you can find your way to peace.

For me it was surrendering to my sexuality to my Higher Power. Ive been sober for just over eight months - I don't think that would have been possible for me without the fellowship of fellow addicts.

It took me a long time to come to terms with that label and that my behaviour was unhealthy, but I figure, just because my drug of choice is a chemical released in my brain doesn't make me less of an addict.

I carry my meth lab around in my skull.

I agree that SLAA is a good and helpful program for sex/porn addicts. Haven't tried SA, have friends who like SAA - just try all of whatever's in your area or that you can find online: the more help the better. Also sex addicts I've known have sworn by the books of Patrick Carne which I haven't read. Escape From Intimacy I have read, it's short and good and describes exactly what you're talking about in terms of sex addicts building up a tolerance and getting into darker things and more and more dangerous behavior. The addicts who do best according to research in this excellent book are those who can find an individual therapist as well as doing a group program (like SAA etc) so do both if you can - just make sure your therapist knows about addiction. You are not alone - there are others who understand and have faced and conquered this addiction. Get help before you cause irreparable harm. You don't need to tell your wife before you find a source of help - if you get help the people who help you may be able to show you the best way and time to talk to your wife about it. Good luck and start today while you have the willingness to quit - it can disappear.

Edit: The groups I mentioned are all free just in case you weren't aware of that fact - they're just addicts helping addicts.