{"product":{"product_id":"0812968581","title":"The Rising Sun: The Decline and Fall of the Japanese Empire, 1936-1945 (Modern Library War)","price":"23.6","image_url":"https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/51WaV8puwtL._SL500_.jpg","url":"https://www.amazon.com/dp/0812968581"},"comments":[{"body":"Japan did not try to surrender before the nukes dropped. Some third party proxies had gone out for some peace feeling but conditions were confusing for instance.\r\n\r\nThe [Rising Sun](https://www.amazon.com/Rising-Sun-Decline-Japanese-1936-1945/dp/0812968581) talks about this, how even after the first atomic bomb was dropped, the Japanese Cabinet was divided on what conditions the surrender would happen under. The Soviet invasion of Manchuria (some cabinet ministers were hoping for a negotiation led by Stalin) and the second atomic bomb forced the Emperor to no longer stay above fray and he ordered the cabinet to surrender.\r\n\r\nSome diehard Japanese war hawks actually attempted a palace coup afterwards but it was quashed. They were also attempting to find the Emperor's surrender broadcast but it was smuggled out by attendants if I remember correctly. \r\n\r\nI'm not saying the US was innocent. Many civilians died in firebombings. I'm just saying your info is wrong on this bit.","subreddit_name":"movies","author":"DarkLiberator"},{"body":"Just got through this part in John Toland’s [The Rising Sun](https://www.amazon.com/Rising-Sun-Decline-Japanese-1936-1945/dp/0812968581).\r\nWhat’s crazy is surviving Japanese pilots who returned from the battle claimed an astounding victory, that the whole American fleet had been destroyed. When in reality, Japanese air power in the Pacific ceased to exist, losing ~500 aircraft.\r\n\r\n\u0026gt;Surviving Japanese pilots returned with tales of a stunning victory. It was reported that practically the whole U.S. Third Fleet had been sunk and that the American carrier force was left in shambles. Though some members of the IJN command were initially skeptical of such reports, this narrative was carried forward by members of the cabinet until it reached Emperor Hirohito. He congratulated the Navy and Army for their success. Newspapers in particular trumpeted these claims, repeating that the U.S. task force was broken and in retreat. Even those unconvinced members of the IJN, up to and including Toyoda, believed some kind of victory had been achieved off Formosa.\r\n\r\nThis battle would also be a turning point of Japanese tactics, as the first organized Kamikaze attack units would be formed following the defeat.","subreddit_name":"ImperialJapanPics","author":"Beeninya"},{"body":"For 'the complete book of (insert conflict here)', my favorites are: \r\n\r\n* Josh Tolland's [The Rising Sun: The Decline and Fall of the Japanese Empire, 1936-1945](http://www.amazon.com/Rising-Sun-Decline-Japanese-1936-1945/dp/0812968581) provides a detailed accounting of the Pacific War as it pertained to Japan, and the causes and motivations for Japanese prosecution of the war. Topics covered include the war in China, internal politics from the mid 19th Century, the 'ABCD' encirclement, and the war with the allied powers. This book, combined with the phrase 'cult of domesticity' helped me make it through APUSH\r\n\r\n* I am currently reading Michael Oren's [Six Days of War: June 1967 and the Making of the Modern Middle East](Six Days of War: June 1967 and the Making of the Modern Middle East), which while short on post-war analysis (contrary to what the title might imply), went into quite a bit of detail both in the month leading up to the war, and of course the week itself. ","subreddit_name":"AskHistorians","author":"_CyrilFiggis_"},{"body":"Okay you got your timeline mixed up. Japan didn't surrender until after the twin blows of the second atomic bomb and the invasion by Soviet forces into Manchuria. [This book has a great insight into the Japanese thinking at the time](https://www.amazon.com/Rising-Sun-Decline-Japanese-1936-1945/dp/0812968581). Before then at the time Japan had been hoping that by negotiating with the Soviets they could have peace without surrendering. The US was aware of all this of course since they already broke the Japanese diplomatic codes and knew the Japanese weren't considering unconditional surrender.\r\n\r\nThe first atomic bomb was on August 6th (Hiroshima). It was not until a cabinet meeting on August 9th, which was after the Soviet invasion and the Nagasaki atomic bombing, when surrender was fully on the agenda. The Japanese emperor had to personally intervene to order the cabinet into surrendering (since there was a deadlock with the war faction) and even then there was an [attempted military coup on August 14th trying to halt the surrender and seize the recording of the emperor announcing it.](https://time.com/5877433/wwii-japanese-surrender-coup/)","subreddit_name":"taiwan","author":"DarkLiberator"},{"body":"Groups are not monoliths and people have different opinions. Just because you are a fan of a franchise doesn't mean you have to agree with all of the messages.\r\n\r\nIshiro Honda was a firm anti-war filmmaker and a voice for nuclear non-proliferation. This makes sense as he served in the Pacific War/World War 2, and also made films during Japan's post-war reconstruction and the inherent idealism that human's could move away from armed conflict. There is nothing wrong with idealism, but the reality of human conflict and scare resource will always make that a utopian goal, and not the reality.\r\n\r\nSimilarly boiling down the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki is not so simple to boil down to good or evil. They take place in the bloodiest world wide conflict and a series of escalating Total War scenarios that started with the German Blitz against London, reprisal bombings by the Allies against Germany and the fire-bombings of Japanese cities. It is possible to say that War itself is evil, atrocities are numerous and civilian populations will suffer as a result of their leaders dragging them into conflict; however, War can be justified and when you wage it be prepared to win, and only use it as a measure of last resort.\r\n\r\nEdit: Dan Carlin is exploring the Pacific Conflict which will culminate in the bombings of Hiroshima and Nagasaki, I highly recommend his Hardcore History podcast and the current episode series is called \"Super Nova in the East.\" His podcast episode on strategic bombing is similarily well produced and will provide context for why the Atom Bomb was not a departure from contemporary military tactics [which you can find here](https://www.dancarlin.com/product/hardcore-history-42-blitz-logical-insanity/). Lastly the book [\"The Rising Sun\"](https://www.amazon.com/Rising-Sun-Decline-Japanese-1936-1945/dp/0812968581) is an excellent book on what the Pacific War was like, written by an American but from the Japanese perspective on why armed conflict happened between the USA and Japan and how the conflict ended.\r\n\r\nI say all of this as a fan of history, someone who has studied Japanese language and culture for 15+ years and lived abroad in Japan. I'm not a simple-minded jingoist.","subreddit_name":"GODZILLA","author":"jorzilla"}]}