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The Zen Teaching of Huang Po: On the Transmission of Mind?
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I'd say the next step is to go deeper. I don't think your need to abandon your secular inclinations in order to distill some teachings from zen and other Asian traditions.
Here's a book that really got me, although it might be somewhat advanced for some -- https://www.amazon.com/Zen-Teaching-Huang-Po-Transmission/dp/0802150926
I read it a bunch of times. The Buddhist jargon and put down of other sects might be off-putting, but the basic teaching is very profound and inspiring. The "One Mind" that he espouses and identifies with the "void" or emptiness, doesn't need to be religious or even "spiritual." www.frogzen.com
Huang Po / Huangbo https://www.amazon.com/Zen-Teaching-Huang-Po-Transmission/dp/0802150926
Definitely a famous text and Zen master in the small pool of Hongzhou school Chan texts (the predominantly discussed type of Zen here)
He's credited as Linji's master in the lineage (Japanese name Rinzai, one of the two still existing schools of Zen, named after Linji/Rinzai)
From The Zen Teaching of Huang-Po: On the Transmission of Mind
> It is pure Mind, which is the source of everything and which, whether appearing as sentient beings or as Buddhas, as the rivers and mountains of the world which has form, as that which is formless, or as penetrating the whole universe absolutely without distinctions, there being no such entities as selfness and otherness.
> This pure Mind, the source of everything, shines forever and on all with the brilliance of its own perfection. But the people of the world do not awaken to it, regarding only that which sees, hears, feels and knows as mind. Blinded by their own sight, hearing, feeling and knowing, they do not perceive the spiritual brilliance of the source-substance. If they would only eliminate all conceptual thought in a flash, that source-substance would manifest itself like the sun ascending through the void and illuminating the whole universe without hindrance or bounds.
> Therefore, if you students of the Way seek to progress through seeing, hearing, feeling and knowing, when you are deprived of your perceptions, your way to Mind will be cut off and you will find nowhere to enter. Only realize that, though real Mind is expressed in these perceptions it neither forms part of them nor is separate from them.
>What is known of Huángbò’s teachings comes from two texts, the Ch’uan-hsin Fa-yao (Essential of Mind Transmission) and the Wan-ling Lu (Record of Wan-ling: Japanese: Enryōroku) written by Huángbò’s student, Pei Xiu.[d] Pei compiled the teachings from his own notes and sent the manuscript to the senior monks on Mount Huangbo for further editing and emendation.
https://www.amazon.com/Zen-Teaching-Huang-Po-Transmission/dp/0802150926
Heh. You'll hear that People's History is biased. His intention was to give fuel for a socialist revolution. That's true. What's more important to learn is that everything is biased. The dream of an unbiased media is that. Even when trying to be objective with facts, there's still the question of which facts to use, which leads to subjectivity and bias. In the end, there is no such thing as objective truth (that's a fun rabbit hole to follow)
So in this case "Yes and," those fuckers are still beholden to shareholders, boards, public opinion, etc. Not only does everyone answer to someone, the ironic truth is that the more power you have, the more people you must answer to.
>Nowhere is the use of paradox in Zen illustrated better than in the teaching of Huang Po, who shows how the experience of intuitive knowledge that reveals to a man what he is cannot be communicated by words. With the help of these paradoxes, beautifully and simply presented in this collection, Huang Po could set his disciples on the right path. It is in this fashion that the Zen master leads his listener into truth, often by a single phrase designed to destroy his particular demon of ignorance.
The Zen Teaching of Huang Po: On the Transmission of Mind
I was confused too, until I read this.
>That kind of validation can only be surmised as absurdity and I guess could be seen as my expression of what is on the other side of that fear.
Your writing is very obtuse! I still don't know what you are talking about. Fwiw, I thought you were saying LOL as in: LOL, who would watch this guy, he claimed to be a Christ, what a loon.
>I may be wrong but I recall reading something between you and woo-woo-way about that. Let me stalk a bit and see if I can find the comment ... here.
That was just a spontaneous best-attempt at languaging a mystical state of being by comparing it to the ordinary state of being. Capital-S Self is an arbitrary term for something that cannot properly be expressed in words. Why worry yourself about the wording of something that cannot be expressed in words?
But, if you are still unsure about the relationship of Self to self, or of Mind to mind, try the Zen Teachings of Huang Po. It is by far the purest statements aimed at dispersing this conceptual confusion that clouds all our hopes for bodhi: http://www.amazon.com/The-Zen-Teaching-Huang-Transmission/dp/0802150926
The Zen Teaching of Huang Po is short and very straightforward unlike some Zen books. It has been the single most important book I've read without a doubt.
I've read a couple books by Shunryu Suzuki and found them very helpful. "Zen Mind Beginners Mind" is a book I read and reread many times, each time getting a bit more out of it.
I honestly don't know anything about Seung Sahn or Sawaki or other contemporary teachers. My teacher was Joshu Sasaki Roshi.
When I first started looking into Zen, I was a bit paranoid. Having been raised by very strict atheists who put down all things religions or spiritual, I wanted to be sure I was on the right track of authentic Zen and not in danger of ending up in a cult.
I decided very early on that reading books that have been tested by centuries of time was the safest and so I avoided most modern authors for the first 2 years.
If you enjoy ancient literature, I highly recommend reading a couple of the old sutras. They are often easier to read than some modern shit and they are AMAZING considering how long ago they were written.
My favorites so far as the Surangama Sutra and the Lankavatara Sutra.
Do you really want me to quote my own comments?
Lame? lol
If you’re looking for “zen entertainment” and distraction, you really should sign up for a retreat with Warner.
Or, sign up for this retreat instead. With illustrations! Isn’t that something?
Out of context? Don’t worry, brother… Context is coming!
Here… some context.
Here… some context for later.
I’m not applying any dogma. Dogma means “belief or set of beliefs”. No belief needed for zen. I’m not “making my own idea of zen”. I’m quoting. Big difference.
If you aren’t accepting teachings from Joshu, then you are not accepting teachings about zen.
Simple as that.
You might try the Zen record from China before 1300: https://www.amazon.com/Zen-Teaching-Huang-Po-Transmission/dp/0802150926
https://www.reddit.com//r/zen/wiki/getstarted
I don't recommend any modern stuff from the Zen tradition, incidentally; the Japanese transmission (which Western Zen has a basis on) seems corrupted (like corrupted data, not political corruption), in all honesty. Zen has extra bite; if you reach for any method, the Zen master has a smack for you.
Primary sources in Zen Buddhism are not really "essays or sayings by Zen Masters" but rather they are sutras, which espouse the Buddhist teachings. For your question what would be relevant would be the prajñāpāramitā sutras, which you can read here. The two most influential prajñāpāramitā sutras are probably the Heart sutra and the Diamond sutra.
Secondary sources would be "essays or sayings by Zen Masters", since they are commentaries on those sutras. For example, Awakening of Faith is a famous summary, as are Huangbo's teachings, but they are more like a teaching about the sutras. The sutras are the earliest teaching.
Start wherever you want.
I would suggest Huangbo or LinJi though.
Physical copy: https://www.amazon.com/Zen-Teaching-Huang-Po-Transmission/dp/0802150926
Zen Teachings of Huang Po was also suggested to me
These have been the four most influential books in my practice:
Also, with some googling, you can find free PDFs of all four of these.
>Transmission of Mind by Huangbo
Are you referring to this book?
Why not start there? https://www.amazon.com/Zen-Teaching-Huang-Po-Transmission/dp/0802150926
Unless... you don't study Zen?
"It is that which you see before you. Begin to reason about it and you at once fall into error." Zen Master Huang Po, from this superb book
Watts is nice, witty, but he is Zen Lite ;) Here's the definitive Zen text (an awful oxymoron). It's as full-octane Zen as you can get.
The Zen Teaching of Huang Po: On the Transmission of Mind
http://www.amazon.com/The-Zen-Teaching-Huang-Transmission/dp/0802150926
fundies gonna have to find other ways to revolt
You are misrepresenting the argument.
- First we have the word dhyana.
- Then we have a Chinese word which meant something different but got used to represent dhyana: chan.
- Then we have the word chan used as a proper name for a group which has a history of more than one proper name.
- At no point do the words dhyana or chan get used to mean a sitting meditation or really any kind of meditative state.
Blofeld's Huangbo. https://www.amazon.com/dp/0802150926/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_apa_i_Ef7-Fb1R45DPZ
- See also: r/zen,/wiki/getstarted
you have no evidence of me making personal attacks on people as a means of dispensing with their arguments. " Calling a troll a troll or a liar a liar is not an attack necessarily... Not if you can prove that these things are true.
Again you have no evidence of me saying anything baseless or religious.
- Repeating accusations you can't prove is a troll tactic; you using it repeatedly makes you a troll.
Why so liar, troll?
> All the while, under the guise of creating a Reddit-specific fake zen based on certain approved "Chan" texts- approved by actual scholars with training and the ability to read/speak Asian languages? No.
- Huangbo; <em>On the Transmisison of Mind</em>; J. Blofeld
- Linji; <em>The Recorded Sayings of Linji</em>; J.C. Cleary
- Foyan; <em>Instant Zen: Waking Up in the Present</em>; T. Cleary
Do you object to these translations or these masters?
These three alone destroy your entire comment. They obliterate it into myriad chiliochosms.
That's what Zen Masters teach. Read Huangbo.
https://www.amazon.com/Zen-Teaching-Huang-Po-Transmission/dp/0802150926/
To the uninitiated perhaps. You should read this, one of my favorites. Much less religious religion than you may be used to, more mind-blowing epiphanies about the nature of reality.
If you're a watts fan, The Way of Zen and Tao: The Watercourse Way are dope. Especially the latter. One of the best books i've ever read.
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