What is Reddit's opinion of
Delta Chat?
From 3.5 billion Reddit comments
➔ Delta Chat website
By popularity on Reddit, this Service is:
33 reviews of this app found across Reddit:
Tips to save yourself from surveillance in general:
Don't use mainstream social media platforms. Don't use whatsapp or similar proprietary messaging platforms.
Encrypt your mails with PGP.
If you can't live without using a messenger, Use https://delta.chat is an email based instant messenger with encryption baked in by default. Its basically an email client but with a messenger like user interface. So, anyone in this world with an email address can be reached.
Move to decentralized systems like /r/zeronet which has tor on by default. Zeronet is popular in China & their gov failed to block it.
Aside from the standard "whats wrong with xmpp" (which I've been yelling into the darkness for >15 years), I recently came across Delta Chat.
Basically uses IMAP + SMTP to achieve messaging functionality, and appears to be backwards compatible with plain email users.
It honestly seems to work better than I initially expected, but TBH, I haven't had a chance to really use it a lot.
> I'm not advocating for protonmail but it's really silly how his video put it, the comments on it are even more stupid, well, at least there were a few calling out his bullshit.
Sure, but I have no idea who are you talking about, I'm just trying to shed some light on how stuff actually works, considering it is my day job ;)
> Ultimately something like autocrypt is the most universal solution which almost nobody has implemented on the services like tutanota or protonmail (which don't really use imap), the only provider which I can think of who has implemented it as a feature is posteo.
I don't think javascript based solutions are in any way secure, cause usually you load random code from the internet, which also happens in case of Protonmail or Tutanota apps.
Imap is a standard, there is no reason to deviate from it, especially when we can use it as an end to end encrypted messaging without relying on any specific provider (aside from GPG, check out Delta Chat).
Noch eine Alternative: Delta Chat
Funktioniert über's Email-Protokoll, d.h. Deine Leute sehen Deine Nachricht als Email, sofern sie nicht auch die App installiert haben. Haben beide Partner die App, kann man auch verschlüsselt chatten.
Comme GPG est quand même relativement chiant a utiliser, je conseillerai plutôt d'utiliser deltachat qui offre une interface a la Whatsapp/Telegram/Messenger mais en faisant tout passer par les emails.
Their about page is very confusing and I'm not entirely sure what differs it from other messengers (it's instant but uses email but also WhatsApp...?) But their source is available and looks legitimate.
They could probably do with a new about page though.
Sorry, but hard disagree. A
> full featured federated social media platform that isn't segregated to several different services that addresses the unique needs of a federated ecosystem
is an oxymoron. If you only have a single platform you're not a federated system anymore, and if you're open for federation you'll always have the possibility of specialized services.
Example? If SMTP weren't an open, federated service (although it never was called that) you wouldn't have the opportunity to run either Sendmail, Postfix, or MS Exchange, and I doubt you'd have a Chat service like Delta Chat on top of it.
Also, the Fediverse isn't just Mastodon, Friendica, and HubZilla. You'd have to add the functionality of PeerTube (YouTube), Pixelfed (Instagramm), FunkWhale (Spotify), WriteFreely (Wordpress), … and have it accessible enough that people are still willing to run their own instance, and make sure that you have enough developers to keep up with any security issues that will arise.
There's probably a way to engineer around that. You could store notes as emails in a separate folder and use some kind of linking mechanism based on some email ID. Delta Chat (https://delta.chat/en/) implements a messenger app around IMAP mailboxes, which is not a normal use case for email.
For example let's say a note is behind the scenes a reply-to-self with a special label. A regular IMAP client could show the note as a reply-to-self, but the PM (web)clients could show them in a custom way. Updating a note could mean deleting the original email and re-replying to self with the special label - or a note would always remain as a draft.
The idea sounds neat - not sure if/how I'd use it myself, but it's interesting.
Yes it's just a client with a chat interface, silimar to WhatsApp. You can use it with anyone with an email address and the other user doesn't need it to reply back, even encryption will still work.
You could use it on TutuaNota, you can use it with any email address, like your own email server for example. You just set up as you would with any other email client.
https://delta.chat ? Not exactly an email app, but in fact it is. Unfortunately only Android and emulators now.
Hope lots of email clients for mobile and desktop start using same user friendly approach of it ( https://autocrypt.org/ )
Тогда https://delta.chat
Там тоже шифрование, группы, видеозвонки, при этом он работает поверх электропочты. А электропочта есть у всех, у кого её нет - тот пит и вывается. Рано или поздно собеседнику надоест пользоваться своим почтовым клиентом для чат-переписки и он тоже поставит ДС, тогда заработает E2E-шифрование
> I also wouldn't consider PGP "easy" for your average user since it still requires some mechanism for posting or sharing your public keys before conversing with another person.
That's why I said https://delta.chat/en/ ;) An email-based messenger with https://autocrypt.org/
> PGP only encrypts the body of your email, whereas our service encrypts the entire payload, metadata included. Sometimes more can be learned from your email's metadata than the content itself.
But that is the central part of your distributed service, if I understand it right? The metadata are only encrypted for and within your service. How would you route the packages/emails otherwise? So you need to expose metadata somewhere, either internally - so you have access to them - for routing or somewhere else.
> Right now our service is sending emails over the wire, but it will soon send any type of file.
So basically some P2P-file sharing directly with a person e.g. as in Limewire, Gnutella, BearShare?
> Right now there isn't a good way to email or share sensitive documents online.
Not agreeing with that, there is encryption, Tor/I2P etc. journalists use https://github.com/freedomofpress/securedrop for example, others put an encrypted file to their Nextcloud and share a link. You can also setup your thunderbird in a way, that it's using your Nextcloud instance to encrypt and upload any attachments automatically.
> With Telios you could email someone an encrypted 20GB attachment if you wanted or send and receive files much like dropbox, except everything would be e2e encrypted and not centrally stored
Hmm, that sounds only reasonable if you want to send this file only once. If you want to sent it to 10 different persons e.g. in a project you would need to upload 10x20GiB while essentially needing to be online with your device for the whole time while the file is being uploaded ...
Email is a robust, mature, distributed, encryptable technology that isn't controlled by anybody. And with the right software isn't functionally different than any other direct messaging service. For example: https://delta.chat
DeltaChat. Shares most of the advantages of Signal, but rather than finding people via phone number, Delta Chat can use email addresses. Delta Chat is also very resistant to being blocked (unlike Signal which can be blocked). While E2EE and secure, a server will know the email address, which can be mitigated by using an anonymous email address and/or Tor network.
Je trouve l'initiative géniale mais pour pouvoir utiliser ça comme un tchat en live il faut aussi que la personne en face le comprenne. C'est juste d'un point de vue usage de la langue, si quelqu'un commence un tchat en me disant "yo", je comprends et c'est logique. Si je reçois un mail avec quelqu'un qui me dit "yo", je comprends pas parce que j'utilise pas une interface logique pour ce genre d'échanges.
Donc si moi j'utilise l'interface, tout va bien, mais je vais pas pourvoir envoyer "yo" à quelqu'un en m'attendant à une réponse instantanée dans le même format, sauf s'il utilise aussi delta.chat , et on en revient au besoin de convertir tout le monde sur un nouveau système
> Peu sécurisé, blindé de spam, d'arnaque, de hameçonnage, pas fait pour communiquer en direct etc.
Pas d'accord. Ça c'est quand tu utilises le mail comme si c'était du courrier électronique, mais le mail c'est juste un vecteur qui permet de faire passer ce que tu veux... et notamment des messages chiffrés si tu le veux. Je ne vais pas prétendre que tout le monde peut passer a PGP facilement, mais il y a des protocoles et des applications qui implémentent tout ça pour toi; au final tu te retrouves avec une application qui fait du chat tout ce qu'il y a de plus standard, mais dont tous les messages transitent par le mail, sont chiffrés de bout en bout, permettent les communications de groupe, les partages de position, les messages audio/video, ...
Le protocole: https://autocrypt.org
L'application: https://delta.chat/fr/
https://delta.chat/de/ könnte dir gefallen:
> Delta Chat ist wie Telegram oder Whatsapp, aber ohne Tracking oder zentrale Steuerung. Delta Chat benötigt nicht Ihre Telefonnummer. Schauen Sie unsere Datenschutzerklärung an.
> Delta Chat betreibt keine eigenen Server, verwendet jedoch das umfangreichste und vielfältigste offene Messaging-System überhaupt: das bestehende E-Mail-Server-Netzwerk.
Il faut faire la différence entre email le protocole et email l'expérience utilisateur. C'est justement parce que les deux ont toujours été étroitement imbriqués qu'on continue d'utiliser les emails comme si on envoyait du courrier, avec des salutations, des "Cordialement" et des signatures. Mais on peut tout a fait utiliser les emails pour de la messagerie instantanée comme le prouve Deltachat. Tu peux aussi utiliser les emails pour créer un article de blog, avec wordpress ou des solutions spécialisées. Tu peux même utiliser une adresse publique, et laisser les gens répondre a ton article, et pouf! des commentaires.
Ces applis marchent et montrent qu'on peut utiliser le protocole pour aller beaucoup plus loin que ce qu'on a l'habitude de faire: il faut arrêter de penser "Destinataire: ", "Sujet: " et mettre une signature de 6 pieds de long quand ce n'est pas le bon format.
> bonne chance pour partager une grosse vidéo de plus de 25Mo
Dans tous les cas d'utilisations que j'ai cités, seul Youtube a des pièces jointes de plus de 25 Mo, et pourrait effectivement profiter d'un protocole plus adapté. A part ça tout le reste est suffisamment faible en poids pour transiter via l'email.
> Jean-Marc, 45 ans de bureau derrière lui qui partage la "dernière" vidéo drôle en date qui a déjà plus de 3 à 5 ans d'âge.
Tiens, ça a l'air de répondre a la question de /u/Andvarey: un réseau social pour boomers
Hi. I also love the concept of Delta Chat and wish everyone would use it.
According to the FAQ https://delta.chat/en/help#is-delta-chat-compatible-with-protonmail--tutanota--criptext
Delta Chat does not work with Protonmail. So you got to look elsewhere.
Personally, I use fastmail which works fine with deltachat.
> I realized, I am the asshole for forcing people to use an app they don't care about.
But the people are in return forcing you to use an app you don't want to use! (Can work this both ways)
As long there are means available to contact you which are available to everyone I see no problems. Is anyone going to fault you because you don't have a smartphone at all and use a regular landline?
I think the only fault with the switch to Signal is moving from one closed network to another one (closed as in it requires a specific app as gateway). I'd love if we could take a step back and use something truly open like email to build upon (https://delta.chat i.e.).
Take a look at delta chat, it's an email client that looks like a chat app. It allows you to have encrypted conversations and disappearing messages, and you can choose any email provider like proton mail. Just be sure that the receiving end also use the app for the encryption to kick in.
Mai usato, non scherzo, WA&c, ho regolari e costanti pressioni per usarlo e regolarmente declino. Se vuoi suggerire un'alternativa suggerisci la mail, es. da mobile via DeltaChat (clone di WA, in termini di UI) o COI. Ovvero dei client di posta che han la faccia di client di chat; uno screenshot vale più di mille parole: https://delta.chat
tutti han già una mail. Quindi tu puoi comunicare via mail con tutti e tutti con te. Se scegli l'ennesima crapplicazione chattica parli solo con coloro che la stessa hanno, e sono tipicamente pochi.
https://delta.chat/en/help#does-delta-chat-support-perfect-forward-secrecy
>Does Delta Chat support Perfect Forward Secrecy?
>
>No
kthxbye. Even OTR messaging released in 2004 supports forward secrecy. Using 30-year old PGP protocol is a joke.
You've basically described email, lol
However, I realise that email has a really bad reputation, so have a look at Delta Chat, which is...erm....email, but encrypted and in a chat/text type interface.
Keep it separate from your other emails by simply not subscribing to the folder it uses in your usual email client, and Bob's your uncle, your email account is now an email account and a totally separate, secured instant messaging account, with far more options than any dedicated instant messaging account/provider/platform has.
And it's cross platform.
And it works with any email provider, (that allows IMAP access).
And it works with people who use PGP to encrypt emails already.
And it's totally free, (might even be open source, I don't remember).
In all seriousness, email for some insane and ridiculous reason has an incredibly bad rep but it beats all instant messaging type services and applications hands down if you are willing to look beyond the terrible reputation that it has.
It's the best "text messaging" service that's ever been invented and it still offers way more than the competition.
It's purely down to how you use it.
If you are OK with registering with your phone number to a service like signal I hope you don't mind using a email address you already use or create a burner one from a provider which have imap support and give a tryout to delta chat.
I was replying to a comment about auto crypt specs being from 2017, but it was deleted in the meanwhile. Anyway, here's the reply:
RSA was invented in 1977 and it still a valid and de facto public-key cryptosystem if you use keys >= 2048 bits, so age don't necessarily mean deprecation. Delta.chat is a safe decentralized E2EE app under actively development. Unless you're a known terrorist, no agency will deploy the absurd amount of computer power needed to break a RSA 4096 key. Using Delta.chat will keep any praying eyes away from your content, even if you use gmail or hotmail email servers, which I don't by the way.
> I'm not sure I understand why you're worried about using your phone number with Signal.
I don't care what is written in their privacy policy. I'm not giving my phone number, period. If they want to verify my identity, use an email for which I can provide an alias.
> delta chat. I won't give you credentials to my email. > Yet you have a Reddit account...
You should have a look at how it works: https://delta.chat/en/help#what-is-delta-chat
"You do not have to sign up anywhere, just use your existing e-mail account with Delta Chat." https://delta.chat/en/help#why-do-i-have-to-enter-my-e-mail-password-into-delta-chat-is-this-secure
No way I'm going to give access to any of my email address. Yes, I could use a dedicated email for that. But it's too much trouble for non-geek. It fails to be simple.
I don't use chat myself. However, Delta Chat seems to be an open source program which you can use with whatever email account you want. So why insist on an email provider which only works by invitation ?
It's very unlikely that anyone with a system.li account would extend an invitation to a total stranger on the Internet. The whole invitation system is precisely meant to only invite people you personally know, and can vouch for.
>Delta Chat doesn’t have their own servers but uses the most massive and diverse open messaging system ever: the existing e-mail server network.
>
> All you need is a standard e-mail account.
So use whatever email provider suits you, and is open to all. And one that has better privacy than system.li, if privacy is of concern to you.
I use Tutanota and I'm happy with it, but there are plenty of competitors available. Choose the one which best matches your needs.
I was doing the same, for the exact same reason. In the end, I switched to Delta Chat. No more lost messages, disconnections or an extra server to maintain as you probably already running an email server (if not, a third party provider is an option even if not self hosted). Moreover, you'll always find a way to send an email from your scripts.
Delta Chat has an iOS version https://delta.chat/en/
Given her technical skills, (you are right, that's an incredibly low bar), and her reluctance to accept assistance, you might be stuck unless you use a messaging app like Telegram, but with all those I know of you would lose the "threaded discussion" nature of email.
Does she have family she trusts with the technical ability to organise her email with a couple of filters, and a folder, so everything is automatically separated from the noise for her and maintain timely notifications perhaps, (so instead of two accounts just better organisation of her existing email account)?
I'd suggest Matrix (as others did already). There is a multitude of applications for many OSes.
Secondly, a more oldschool but still relevant option: IRC. However, you are only reachable if currently only. There are serverside clients that keep your account connected, when you are offline - feels like any ither chat system.
Lastly, something i personally love - https://delta.chat no need to create a new account, "accounts" are your already existing email addresses. You can also messege ppl that do not use delta chat, but just normal email. Rather convenient & decentralized!
You should include delta chat for android email with autocrypt. https://delta.chat/en/ Simple mobile tools https://simplemobiletools.github.io/ which are simple secure builds of basics like contacts calender camera etc and you really need to include root apps like afwall+ which is a firewall , adaway and other apps like net guard (proxy firewall). Etc
Delta Chat? https://delta.chat/
It feels like WhatsApp but uses the e-mail infrastructure, no calls or conferences though, just instant messaging. Messages are encrypted with AutoCrypt (opportunistic encryption for e-mail) and by default it stores the messages in a folder not to kill your actual e-mail inbox.
Unless you choose a problematic mail server even non techies can setup and use it. GMail gives apparently some problems, but I used gmx.com as the mail server and everything went fine.